Koran should be taught in OUR schools.

kernow · 26-03-2008, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smidgey

I would be happy if they were taught RE in an objective way in the proper class. Others might disagree, and that should be their choice - not the choice of the state and not the choice of the church.

I'm with you on this!

The Bear · 26-03-2008, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjt

Surely if there is a demand for faith schools they should be provided, is not the way to a good education system best achieved by the provision of choice?

No. If it were that a particular school was associated with pedophilia but offered a better than usual education would that mean that such a school should be allowed to continue to exist?

Of course not, and religion is as bad as paedophiles where children are concerned.

The only difference is that, with the exception of the Madrassas where beating is a part of the so called education, the scarring that the children usually get is mental but it still lasts throughout their lives.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjt

I think actually many parents choose faith schools because they provide good quality education not due to any personal religous beleif.

Children should be protected from belief in god (or gods).

Such belief is illogical and if it were not for deep seated indoctrination would rightly result on those showing such delusional beliefs being subject to psychiatric treatment.

That it is taking vested interest groups to provide decent education is a reflection on how terrible UK state education is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjt

I would also note that the local children I come into contact with who have been to faith schools and/or attend church regualrly tend to be better behavied then the little savages that ramapge down my road at night who regualalry behave in a way that makes me think that they need a good sharp clip round the ear.

That has far more to do with the standard of the school than the involvement of and close association with religion. All it indicates is how awful the state system is, rather than how “good” it is that children should be being exposed to ANY religion or that such exposure does them any good whatsoever.

After all, the absence of bad does not mean the presence of good.

I see teaching children that there is such a thing as god as being exactly the same as any other form of child abuse and if anything worse than a good many forms.

Children should be protected from the religious.

Faith schools are the psychological equivalent of the dreadful practice of female genital mutilation so avidly practiced by certain ethno-religious groups within Britain to this day and about which nothing is getting done.

g hall · 26-03-2008, 03:51 PM

Education is provided by the public and private sector. There should be lessons on belief systems to include ethics and morals. There should be free discussion on these, if someone then wishes to join or experience a belief fine BUT outside of normal school time.
There should be NO faith/belief schools in the system

I know that in earlier centuries the Christian church and indeed other faiths/beliefs have sponsored education but evidence is that that was done as a form of control

If any faith/belief system wishes to be tolerated then it must tolerate as well

May your invisible friend go with you

rjt · 26-03-2008, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Bear

No. If it were that a particular school was associated with pedophilia but offered a better than usual education would that mean that such a school should be allowed to continue to exist?

Of course not, and religion is as bad as paedophiles where children are concerned.

The only difference is that, with the exception of the Madrassas where beating is a part of the so called education, the scarring that the children usually get is mental but it still lasts throughout their lives.

Children should be protected from belief in god (or gods).

Such belief is illogical and if it were not for deep seated indoctrination would rightly result on those showing such delusional beliefs being subject to psychiatric treatment.

That it is taking vested interest groups to provide decent education is a reflection on how terrible UK state education is.

That has far more to do with the standard of the school than the involvement of and close association with religion. All it indicates is how awful the state system is, rather than how “good” it is that children should be being exposed to ANY religion or that such exposure does them any good whatsoever.

After all, the absence of bad does not mean the presence of good.

I see teaching children that there is such a thing as god as being exactly the same as any other form of child abuse and if anything worse than a good many forms.

Children should be protected from the religious.

Faith schools are the psychological equivalent of the dreadful practice of female genital mutilation so avidly practiced by certain ethno-religious groups within Britain to this day and about which nothing is getting done.

I pray nobody holding your views ever gets near the department of education.

rjt · 26-03-2008, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Bear

No. If it were that a particular school was associated with pedophilia but offered a better than usual education would that mean that such a school should be allowed to continue to exist?

Of course not, and religion is as bad as paedophiles where children are concerned.

The only difference is that, with the exception of the Madrassas where beating is a part of the so called education, the scarring that the children usually get is mental but it still lasts throughout their lives.

Children should be protected from belief in god (or gods).

Such belief is illogical and if it were not for deep seated indoctrination would rightly result on those showing such delusional beliefs being subject to psychiatric treatment.

That it is taking vested interest groups to provide decent education is a reflection on how terrible UK state education is.

That has far more to do with the standard of the school than the involvement of and close association with religion. All it indicates is how awful the state system is, rather than how “good” it is that children should be being exposed to ANY religion or that such exposure does them any good whatsoever.

After all, the absence of bad does not mean the presence of good.

I see teaching children that there is such a thing as god as being exactly the same as any other form of child abuse and if anything worse than a good many forms.

Children should be protected from the religious.

Faith schools are the psychological equivalent of the dreadful practice of female genital mutilation so avidly practiced by certain ethno-religious groups within Britain to this day and about which nothing is getting done.

Then dont send any child to a faith school if you dont like them but dont seek to deny that choice to those who do, we all pay taxes you know.

Kevin Adamson · 26-03-2008, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjt

I dont see how you can give a child a well rounded education without teaching them religion it is after all tied up with a vast majority of human history.

A fair point RJT , The basic beliefs of the different religions could be covered in the first history lesson of the syllabus when required.

Tara · 26-03-2008, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Bear

No. If it were that a particular school was associated with pedophilia but offered a better than usual education would that mean that such a school should be allowed to continue to exist?

Of course not, and religion is as bad as paedophiles where children are concerned.

The only difference is that, with the exception of the Madrassas where beating is a part of the so called education, the scarring that the children usually get is mental but it still lasts throughout their lives.

Children should be protected from belief in god (or gods).

Such belief is illogical and if it were not for deep seated indoctrination would rightly result on those showing such delusional beliefs being subject to psychiatric treatment.

That it is taking vested interest groups to provide decent education is a reflection on how terrible UK state education is.

That has far more to do with the standard of the school than the involvement of and close association with religion. All it indicates is how awful the state system is, rather than how “good” it is that children should be being exposed to ANY religion or that such exposure does them any good whatsoever.

After all, the absence of bad does not mean the presence of good.

I see teaching children that there is such a thing as god as being exactly the same as any other form of child abuse and if anything worse than a good many forms.

Children should be protected from the religious.

Faith schools are the psychological equivalent of the dreadful practice of female genital mutilation so avidly practiced by certain ethno-religious groups within Britain to this day and about which nothing is getting done.

Does the above apply to Jewish faith schools? And if so, would you consider yourself to be anti-semetic?

a swansong 4 europe · 26-03-2008, 07:48 PM

When I was taught RE all those years ago, it was solely the study of the bible and that of Jesus, NO other religion came into the subject, and I imagine that was the way it was from the time when RE was introduced as a subject.

The Bear · 27-03-2008, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tara

Does the above apply to Jewish faith schools? And if so, would you consider yourself to be anti-semetic?

Of course it applies to Jewish schools. Why should they be any different from any other? In fact there should BE no Jewish schools. Or C of E schools or Roman Catholic schools or Madrassas or ANY church orientated much less church funded schoold.

Religion being taught as fact has no place in the education of kids.

Is that anti-Semitic?

No, it's anti-religion.

Children need to be protected from what is no less than child abuse as sure as any other form of child abuse ranging from Female Genital Mutilation to rabid pedophilia.

Church people think that it is their religion that delivers good morality (though it is always based on the values of their particular fairy story) and totally miss the point that their religion to some degree simply acts as a vehicle to deliver good humanitarian morality.

Good morality is better delivered to kids outside of any religious wrapping. For one thing it does away with the idea that “our way is good their way is not” at a stroke not to mention relieves people of what often amounts to a life of guilt constantly asking themselves things like “What would Jesus do?” or constantly reciting verses of the Quoran to justify their every action.

Religion in schools?

Its disgusting.

Smidgey · 27-03-2008, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjt

Then dont send any child to a faith school if you dont like them but dont seek to deny that choice to those who do, we all pay taxes you know.

I dont agree with the Bear at all, but you must realise that 'secular' state schools still have prayers in the assembly halls when all the children are there as well as having the local minister come and give sermons on Friday mornings (it was Friday when I was still at school).

Not to mention that schools are being taken over, like in America, by corporations - we have vending machines with 'COCA COLA' stamped across them, adverts for fairtrade which are clearly political in nature (which Tito pointed to in another post) and many other such political and religious influences.

There is very little choice in the state system and much of it is biased towards a specific religious and political doctrine.

26-03-2008, 03:51 PM	#23 (permalink)
g hall Uber Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 4,940	Education is provided by the public and private sector. There should be lessons on belief systems to include ethics and morals. There should be free discussion on these, if someone then wishes to join or experience a belief fine BUT outside of normal school time. There should be NO faith/belief schools in the system I know that in earlier centuries the Christian church and indeed other faiths/beliefs have sponsored education but evidence is that that was done as a form of control If any faith/belief system wishes to be tolerated then it must tolerate as well May your invisible friend go with you __________________ "That government is best which governs least." "This is a sharp Medicine, but it is a Physician for all diseases and miseries". "To be "matter of fact" about the world is to blunder into fantasy --and dull fantasy at that, as the real world is strange and wonderful."

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26-03-2008, 07:48 PM	#28 (permalink)
a swansong 4 europe Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 411	When I was taught RE all those years ago, it was solely the study of the bible and that of Jesus, NO other religion came into the subject, and I imagine that was the way it was from the time when RE was introduced as a subject.