right wing

extra ordinary · 10-11-2007, 09:21 PM

have you noticed that the bbc plus poss.others,
now sometimes do not even bother with the phrase far right or extreme right or even neo nazi.
they just say right wing. I think that if it is far right they should say so and not label as simply right wing.
I heard it on a lunchtime show, then again on teletex and then again on a slot about web sites.
is it that this is just lazy reporting or are they defining anyone with non centre or non left views as dangerous and facist ?

Smidgey · 10-11-2007, 09:48 PM

I'm fed up of people calling the far right, the far right. Most of the time they are in fact left wingers. Such as the Nazi's, they were National Socialists afterall. Nationalism and socialism are both communitarian values.

Britannist · 10-11-2007, 10:38 PM

What I have noticed is that the BBC call people like the Late General Pinochet (the former leader of Chile who helped the UK during the Falklands dispute) a "dictator" - but the head of the Chinese Government (an unelected dictatorial regime) is a "Prime Minister".

The pinko BBC is biased and its view of the world is one akin to that of the europhile Guardian.

arden forester · 11-11-2007, 08:54 AM

Personally I think left and right wing are meaningless and more so today. I prefer liberal or conservative, with identities like socialist, libertarian, green, etc reinforcing the type of liberal or conservative.

I remember at school being told about the Cold War and the left and right wing thing. I saw a map of the world on the wall with the UK firmly set in the middle. We were told that the Sovient Union could be called left wing and the USA right wing (in general terms of course!).

In my infantile mind I could see that the USA was on the left of the map and the Soviet Union on the right. So for the rest of my life I have this warped memory of the left being on the right and the right being on the left. All very helpful, I'm sure, but for me the true meaning was lost.

mkpdavies · 11-11-2007, 11:07 AM

Fascist or Libertarian. Only two choices there are.

extra ordinary · 11-11-2007, 12:15 PM

thankyou for the replies.

this right or centre or left wing thing is still there for me yet I now find the concept difficult to explain to my son, so maybe you are correct the old order has gone and we have replacement descriptions and goal posts.

kernow · 11-11-2007, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smidgey

I'm fed up of people calling the far right, the far right. Most of the time they are in fact left wingers. Such as the Nazi's, they were National Socialists afterall. Nationalism and socialism are both communitarian values.

It is surprising how many people don't know that fact!

John Carter · 12-11-2007, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extra ordinary

this right or centre or left wing thing is still there for me yet I now find the concept difficult to explain to my son, so maybe you are correct the old order has gone and we have replacement descriptions and goal posts.

'Tis easy:

left / collectivism / fascism <-------------------------> right / individualism / libertarianism

The "far right" are actually lefties, but the "ordinary" lefties don't want anyone to know this because it'll tar their side of the fence. This has always been the case, since leftist theory cannot exist in reality without the removal of liberties (how do the marxists expect to be able to achieve their utopia without stamping on the freedoms of "the rich"?).

mkpdavies · 12-11-2007, 06:18 PM

JC woke me up to this fact. Cheers JC.

IceDragon · 12-11-2007, 10:57 PM

A lot of left wingers swear blind that despite the Nazis centralisation of the state, nationalisation of industry, huge public employment projects and dismantling of the class system they were in any way socialist, as they don't want to be associated with them. Why was it called the National -Socialist- German Workers' Party? They even try to deny the significance of the USSR under Stalin, which is where the concept of leftist ideology naturally ends up.

10-11-2007, 09:21 PM	#1 (permalink)
extra ordinary Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: south east Posts: 196	right wing have you noticed that the bbc plus poss.others, now sometimes do not even bother with the phrase far right or extreme right or even neo nazi. they just say right wing. I think that if it is far right they should say so and not label as simply right wing. I heard it on a lunchtime show, then again on teletex and then again on a slot about web sites. is it that this is just lazy reporting or are they defining anyone with non centre or non left views as dangerous and facist ?

10-11-2007, 09:48 PM	#2 (permalink)
Smidgey Uber Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 2,222 Party: Libertarian Party	I'm fed up of people calling the far right, the far right. Most of the time they are in fact left wingers. Such as the Nazi's, they were National Socialists afterall. Nationalism and socialism are both communitarian values. __________________ How vain is man, who boasts in fight the valour of gigantic might! -Georg Friedrich Händel

10-11-2007, 10:38 PM	#3 (permalink)
Britannist Uber Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: London Posts: 22,896	BBC, Late General Pinochet, Chile, UK, Chinese regime What I have noticed is that the BBC call people like the Late General Pinochet (the former leader of Chile who helped the UK during the Falklands dispute) a "dictator" - but the head of the Chinese Government (an unelected dictatorial regime) is a "Prime Minister". The pinko BBC is biased and its view of the world is one akin to that of the europhile Guardian.

11-11-2007, 08:54 AM	#4 (permalink)
arden forester Uber Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Solihull, in The Forest of Arden, Warwickshire! Posts: 2,701 Party: None	Personally I think left and right wing are meaningless and more so today. I prefer liberal or conservative, with identities like socialist, libertarian, green, etc reinforcing the type of liberal or conservative. I remember at school being told about the Cold War and the left and right wing thing. I saw a map of the world on the wall with the UK firmly set in the middle. We were told that the Sovient Union could be called left wing and the USA right wing (in general terms of course!). In my infantile mind I could see that the USA was on the left of the map and the Soviet Union on the right. So for the rest of my life I have this warped memory of the left being on the right and the right being on the left. All very helpful, I'm sure, but for me the true meaning was lost. __________________ www.ardenforester.blogspot.com www.westminster-whispers.blogspot.com

11-11-2007, 11:07 AM	#5 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,183 Party: Libertarian Party	Fascist or Libertarian. Only two choices there are. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

11-11-2007, 12:15 PM	#6 (permalink)
extra ordinary Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: south east Posts: 196	thankyou for the replies. this right or centre or left wing thing is still there for me yet I now find the concept difficult to explain to my son, so maybe you are correct the old order has gone and we have replacement descriptions and goal posts.

12-11-2007, 06:18 PM	#9 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,183 Party: Libertarian Party	JC woke me up to this fact. Cheers JC. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

12-11-2007, 10:57 PM	#10 (permalink)
IceDragon Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 1,048	A lot of left wingers swear blind that despite the Nazis centralisation of the state, nationalisation of industry, huge public employment projects and dismantling of the class system they were in any way socialist, as they don't want to be associated with them. Why was it called the National -Socialist- German Workers' Party? They even try to deny the significance of the USSR under Stalin, which is where the concept of leftist ideology naturally ends up.

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