Anthony Butcher

Yup, I would say that is definitely part of your job description.

That particular idea sounds like a very expensive waste of money

The problem here is that an MEP doesn't need 'good employees', he/she needs people with specific skills and experience to fulfill specific roles, such as PR, administration and research. Is it even legal to employ people on the basis that they are PPCs? Wouldn't that require turning down potential employees probably better suited to the job?

Well that is what I would want a potential MEP to describe. What will you do there that would entice voters to vote for you?

It sounds to me like you have chosen to abandon any genuine role as an MEP. That's fine, and many people will support it, but I want an MEP in there fighting for Britain, not an MEP in Britain fighting for UKIP.

So you think that it is acceptable for tax payers to fork out several hundred thousand quid a year for you to promote UKIP most of the time? I certainly don't.

I would include numerous things in the word 'effective':

• producing useful and accessible reports on the EU
• identifying and tackling specific problems in EU legislation
• bringing the EU issue into the MSM
• constructively engaging inside the EU to promote Britain's interests
• Representing the interests of a region in the EU Parliament.
• Leading by example on expenses and behaviour
• exposing EU corruption

In terms of effectiveness within the party, I would include:

• Inspiring the activists, rather than berating them.
• Ensuring a regular media presence
• Providing campaign support in byelections etc.
• Ensuring that all internal activities are run honestly and fairly.

OK, can you give examples please? What are the aspects of UKIP's current MEPs, other than Farage and Batten, that you would like to emulate?

Certainly there is an element of Devil's Advocate. I am asking you awkward questions

That's a very defeatist attitude though. Politics is a game and even people who are outnumbered can try to change the political landscape to suit their agenda. Governments often perform U-turns when faced with public unhappiness.

Oh. Well, I applaud that! You will be very unpopular with the other MEPs.

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Anthony Butcher

As far as I am aware, Farage has never made a personal donation to the party of any substance. Certainly none have ever been declared to the Electoral Commission, unlike other MEPs who have donated substantial amounts. Also, I am sure that he hasn't used any of his expenses to assist the party because that would be an illegal use of them, and I am not sure that he would thank you for claiming that he has.

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mrabody

In reply to your five points...

1. Presumably this could be said of anyone hired by an MEP. Would you prefer I hire a Europhile to combat the inference that it is jobs for the boys?
2. Using my position to help advance the agenda on which I would be elected - independence from the EU.
3. I've already stated I will publish my expenses. Read my previous reply to you.
4. I said I would give money to worthy initiatives within the Southeast region that would assist in building the party. I'm not intending to write blank cheques to branches. In other words largesse isn't going to fall from the sky. And I also said that any branches that ask for assistance will have to provide me progress reports on any initiative I support. So it's hardly a case of paying people for votes.
5. You still haven't explained to me what an MEP's job is.

If you don't want to vote for UKIP that's entirely your choice. Why not vote Tory - Gile Chichester's bank account will thank you.

I'm open hearing what you expect your UKIP MEP should be doing to earn your vote. And then please follow it up with an explanation of how this will result in the eventual withdrawl of Britain from the EU. Because thats the reason I'm in UKIP and on this forum.

mrabody

I wasn't talking about expenses, but about donations from his own salary. And perhaps Nigel hasn't made a personal donation to the party. On the other hand it can't be cheap travelling all over the country to events can it. And Nigel certainly does spend a lot of time on the road doesn't he.

Anthony Butcher

I said jobs for the boys because you were talking about hiring people because they are PPCs, rather than identifying a need for an employee and then seeking the best person for the job, regardless of their party affiliations.

Promoting UKIP is not the entirely the same as promoting independence from the EU.

Yup, sorry about that, I posted at the same time as you.

As I said, it could easily be interpreted that way, especially since Farage (your main rival for top spot) is well known for NOT providing cash for local operations out of his own pocket. I think that it is a great idea that you are offering, but you should be a little careful how you phrase it.

If you don't know, should you really be applying to do it?

There were dozens of parties on the ballot last time.

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mrabody

Well, it's reassuring to know that we agree on at least one point. Out of little acorns, great oaks may grow.

The same could be said of employing armies of researchers. I happen to think that meeting people personally, if possible is good. It shows concern and it might actually lessen the contempt so many members of the public feel for politicians.

People with administrative skills are not hard to come by. PR skills can be learned. As for research I feel one researcher is sufficient.


I will go to Brussels as required to debate and vote on issues are of importance to my constituents. I note that it is not unusual for MEPs to vote on hundreds of matters a day which makes it virtually impossible to actually scrutinize what you are voting for even if my whole staffing allowance was devoted to researchers paid slave wages so it will really by an exercise in futility.

When I actually vote on a piece of legislation or other matters and my vote is in the majority, i will of course dutifully vote again when the leaders of the European Parliament duly resubmit it and whip the majority Europhile MEPs into being in attendence so that they get their way in the end - even as in the recent case where the rules regarding Euro Parliamentary groupings were changed if the Parliament tears up its own rules in the process.

I will protest from time to time and perhaps I will be so lucky as to be punished in interesting ways that are contrary to the Parliamentary rules as sometimes happens.

It's hard to have a genuine role when the role you are playing by design a sham.

I'm sure a reasonably large segmant of the public that wants us out of the EU would see it as a better use of their tax money than renovating Den Dover's home, or paying the gay lover of some Labour MEP whose names escapes me at the moment etc etc. I think the sight of an elected politician promoting the abolition of his job might warm some hearts amongst the public.

• 1. Reports are nice and all but what are they to be used for?
  2. I will try as best I can to identify and tackle specific problems but we all know that it will happen anyway.
  3. The mainstream media in this country persist in the belief that only what happens at Westminster matters. They will therefore continue to ignore what goes on in Brussels. The only way to get into the MSM here is to get UKIP MPs in Westminster. I will instead concentrate getting the EU issue into the local media. I have been somewhat effective at this as PPC in Lewes where I have had at least six "hits" in the local media.
  4. You say constructive engagement I say Quisling.
  5. Promoting the regionalization of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. I will certainly try to protect the interests of my constituents.
  6. I have already promised to publicize my expenses.
  
  

I note that both Titford and Nattrass have regular columns in local newspapers. You may think that unimportant, I do not. Graham Booth has worked hard to address issues of concern to Britain's Sikh Community. That this doesn't reach the mainstream press doesnt mean that he is inneffective.

I welcome any chance to debate, even with those who have no intention of voting for me.

It's the truth. As I have previously stated, if other European countries begin electing significant numbers of Anti-EU MEPs that might change. And governments don't change their policies unless they are faced with a threat. A bunch of Euro-sceptic MEPs not a threat to unelected commissioners. A contingent of UKIP MEPs in Westminster in 2014 might be of more than passing concern to Prime Minister Cameron and the leaders of the Lib Dem and Labour Parties.


Oh. Well, I applaud that! You will be very unpopular with the other MEPs.[/quote]

I note that most UKIP MEPs have given full details of their expenses as part of Open Europe's Transparency Initiative. So I won't be able to claim to be some sort of trail blazer

In any event if I'm to be shunned by other MEPs it's nice to know to know that I have Daniel Hannan for company.

mrabody

I'm pretty sure that Nigel has a lock on first place. I'm competing for second or possibly third against the remaining candidates. I was under the impression that Nigel donated to the party, but as I have said, the amount of driving and travelling he does on UKIP business must cost him a great deal.

Akebono

Yes, Anthony is generally in touch with how we all feel.
if you think that an MEP cannot help UKIP or UKplc then I think that you may be a little uinsuitable (only kidding)
But in all seriousness i think that -

1.) Expenses and wages should be emailed to the membership.

2.) A limit on the number of cocktail parties once elected to Bruges.

3.) Eshew having a private chaffeur. The trains are pretty good.

4.) Support Farage - which I notice you appear reluctant to do.

Best

mrabody

I think it would be easier to publish expenses and wages in Independence once a year. It's actually more important in any event to make that information available to the wider public.

I'd rather enjoy a pint at my local than coctails in Brussels.

I enjoy driving to much to require a chauffeur. And my wife says I need to exercise more anyway.

I do support Nigel, so I'm not sure what gave you the impression that I don't. If I don't talk about him much in this thread it's because I'm busy promoting me. He is my rival for the purposes of this MEP selection you know...

HM

Would you join the Ind/Dem group and/or try to reform the EU? Nice surname BTW.

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