Aaarrgghh Former UKIP MEP supports secession from the UK

Aardvark · 22-06-2008, 10:27 PM

From Welcome : Ashley Mote MEP

If ever you doubted the man's sanity..................

Quote:

Welcome

First of the British Isles Leaves the European Union - Official

The first of the British Isles to leave the European Union declared its independence yesterday (21 June 2008).

Stuart Hill, the owner of the 2.5 acre island of Forvik, one of the most westerly of the Shetland Islands, announced the restoration of its original legal status and reminded the people of all the Shetland Isles that the same status of independence was theirs by right.

“Forvik neither recognises the British government nor the European Union. It aspires to the same relationship with the UK as the crown dependencies of the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands”, he said.

“Shetland’s relationship with the UK is based on the false assumption that it is part of Scotland, based on long-standing deception and subterfuge at the highest level. The Shetlands have never been part of Scotland, and nobody can even name the day when it is alleged to have joined. By declaring Forvik a crown dependency I am simply re-establishing the correct legal relationship between this part of Shetland and the crown. Shetland as a whole can get the same benefits and more - simply by asserting rights that already exist,” he said.

Welcoming this declaration, independent MEP Ashley Mote called Stuart Hill’s initiative “a triumph for the rule of law. In 1975, the Shetland Isles were the only part of the British Isles to vote solidly against being a part of what became the European Union. Now they have the legal means to be free of it. Millions of others across all the British Isles hope and pray for a government to take the same initiative. Nothing is more important than restoring self-rule for the benefit of the British people, and nothing less is acceptable”.

Forvik Island will not be subject to any taxes levied by the UK government. It will set down a claim to the sea and seabed up to a limit of 200 miles, or to the median line between it and other states, giving it control of fishing and oil reserves.

It will become a tax haven with no income tax, VAT, council tax or corporation tax. The only tax would be a contribution by every citizen towards the cost of running the state, initially set at a level of one Forvik gulde per year - around £55 in today’s money.

In due course Forvik will have its own currency, the ‘gulde’ backed by gold, and issue its own postage stamps. Later Forvik will offer to register companies in a tax-free environment, which may eventually lead to the provision of offshore banking and financial services.

Stuart Hill’s Declaration of Independence includes an indictment against successive British governments. It says:

Indictment:

That the monarchs and governments of Scotland, and Great Britain and The United Kingdom have for many years assumed powers over these islands of Shetland to which they were not entitled.

That those monarchs and governments have imposed a foreign system of laws in breach of their clear obligation to the contrary and that those laws have been used against the people of these islands to their great prejudice.

That the government of the United Kingdom has committed fraudulent acts upon these islands to the great detriment of the people.

That the only powers granted to King James III of Scotland in 1469, when he accepted these islands as security in the matter of payment of a marriage dowry, were those of trustee. His Majesty was holding them in trust until they were redeemed by King Christian of Denmark and Norway or his successors. Part of his obligation was to preserve the existing language and laws. The Plenipotentiaries of Europe confirmed in the 1667 Peace and Treaty of Breda that these arrangements remained in full force at that time and nothing has happened since then to give the monarch or the government any further rights or powers.

That King Charles II confirmed in 1669 that the inhabitants of these islands were to have an immediate dependence upon His Majesty and his officers and the islands were erected into a Stewartry, answering directly to His Majesty and to the exclusion of Parliament.

That King Charles II declared that in the event of a general dissolution of His Majesty’s properties, such as happened in 1707 with the Act of Union, these islands were not to be included, but were to remain in direct dependence to His Majesty.

That Queen Anne ignored the provisions laid down by King Charles II and illegally incorporated Shetland into Great Britain with the Act of Union.

That the government of the United Kingdom forced these islands, to their great disadvantage, to remain in the European Economic Community, and later the European Union, against the clearly stated will of the people.

That the government of the United Kingdom, without any prior right, appropriated the fishing and other rights, in the seas around these islands and gave them to foreign powers.

That the government of the United Kingdom, without any prior right, appropriated the seabed around these islands for the purposes of oil extraction.

That the government of the United Kingdom demands rents for the use of seabed around Shetland, to which they have no right or title.

That the Shetlands Islands Councillors and their legal department, having been advised of these issues and having chosen to take no action, thereby make themselves complicit in illegal acts.

Accordingly I, Stuart Alan Hill, being the udal owner of the island of Forvik, do declare that the said island of Forvik owes no allegiance to any United Kingdom government, central or local, and is not bound by any of its statutes. I offer my services as Steward to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II and acknowledge her rights as being the same, and not more, than were originally granted to King James III in 1469.

kiwi ukipper · 23-06-2008, 02:45 AM

Perhaps he is looking to advance his political career there once he is ejected from the European Parliament...

gimlet · 23-06-2008, 04:59 AM

Excellent news and well done S Hill. Why supporting this move to independance, should be a reflection of someone’s sanity is not clear.

Bob FM · 23-06-2008, 06:40 AM

Sadly eccentrics are perceived by most as being 'thruppence short of a shilling'. There are interesting parallels with those in Cornwall a few years back who claimed independence from the UK.

Aardvark · 23-06-2008, 07:03 AM

A declaration of independence should mean entirely that. Mr Hill is not independent and is running a major scam. He cannot generate electricity or purify water or grow sufficient crops to live on. He is not recognised by any other nation in the world. He has no seat at the UN. He hasn't even got a dwelling house on the island and, in an act of non-independence, has applied to the local authority for planning permission to build a house.

This act is being greeted with mirth across the political world and supporting it shows a paucity of intellect of monumental precautions. Mr Hill has a few supporters amongst the Barking branch of euroscepticism (sorry I meant barking mad), but nobody of any real power, influence or ability supports him.

I would not consider it an honour to be supported by a convicted fraudster and charlatan. Mr Mote was shouted down in the EU Parliament as he tried to lecture people on the rule of law, something for which he apparently cares little as he is not even a tad repentant about being convicted by a jury of his peers of 21 charges (reduced to 20 on appeal) of fraud and theft etc.

I assume, gimlet, that you will be paying £275 for a couple of square feet of infertile bog and rubble (8000 x 275 = £2,200,000). The island is worth a couple of grand at most and Mr Hill is going to flog it to 8000 gullible eurosceptics and white supremacists for an absolute fortune. I suspect Mr Mote owns a half share of this rock and is intending to rip off the foolish and terminally insane for their hard earned cash. He and Mr Hill will issue coins and stamps (which anyone can as they are only tokens after all - Lundy did so to sell souvenirs to tourists) and make even more money from very foolish people. For the stamps to have international validity, in that a letter posted on the rock could be forwarded by the Royal Mail, Mr Hill must join the Universal Postal Union. I suspect that they won't let him in. Offshore banks will not fall for Mote's scam as the island, unlike Jersey, Guernsey, Isle of Man (where Mote banks), Caymans, BVI etc is not recognised in international law.

Go for it gimlet, support the independence scam and allow the convicted fraudster Mote to live in wealth and opulence whilst you don't.

BobFM, Mr Hill is not a Shetlander nor is he Norse, he is a chancer who has bought a lump of rock and is seeking to make a fortune. The Cornish have a different and possible more realistic claim as they are a whole Duchy/Principality. They have a language and culture and history of independence. Shetlands, in its entirety, has belonged to other countries since written records began and is incorporated by the Act of Union into the UK. It was a wedding 'gift'. The Norwegians are not demanding the return of Shetland. Mr Hill is unlikely to have learnt Norwegian for the occasion, although I would be impressed if he had.

The island remains within the EU despite Mr Hills best efforts and his 'fish' still belong to the UK and are subject to CFP. Mr Hill has no navy and no means of stopping everyone else from fishing in his waters.

Independence. Read the dictionary and get a life.

Bob FM · 23-06-2008, 07:25 AM

So he's not a 'nutter' then

chikrodah · 23-06-2008, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Forvik Island will not be subject to any taxes levied by the UK government. It will set down a claim to the sea and seabed up to a limit of 200 miles, or to the median line between it and other states, giving it control of fishing and oil reserves.

Take a look at "forewick holm" - Google Maps to see what that really means.

chikrodah · 23-06-2008, 09:56 AM

For the legally minded forum members:

Quote:

(784) 'CAPTAIN CALAMITY': IS SHETLAND IN SCOTLAND?
10 May 2008 00:00

Stuart Hill (65) gained some media attention with his proclaimed intention to argue in Lerwick Sheriff Court on 25 March 2008 that the court had no jurisdiction since the Shetland Isles are not in law part of Scotland or subject to Scots law. He was being sued in a small claims action by a local accountancy firm called A9 for non-payment of fees. Mr Hill’s argument was based on the unredeemed impignoration of the islands by the Danish to the Scottish Crown in 1469 on the occasion of King James III’s marriage to a daughter of King Christian of Denmark; the suggestion is that this means Shetland was not owned by the Scottish or its successor British state. The case was however postponed for a month as a result of the sheriff for whom it had been set down becoming snow-bound on the mainland, and on 20 April it was reported that Mr Hill had decided to settle with the pursuers and seek another occasion upon which to advance his historical and jurisdictional claims. Possibly by this time he had had an opportunity to consult the article on Udal Law in volume 24 of the Stair Memorial Encyclopaedia, which fairly comprehensively demolishes the argument that Mr Hill intended to put forward, clarifying the key distinction between dominium and sovereignty. Mr Hill has lived in Shetland since being shipwrecked there in 2001, the ignominious end to an ill-fated attempt to sail round Britain anti-clockwise in his 15-foot converted rowing boat with a windsurfing sail. His misadventures en route gave rise to the media nickname “Captain Calamity” even before the final capsize of the vessel off Shetland (see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/1503308.stm). Mr Hill now runs a website called The Shetland Conversation, apparently dedicated to the cause of independence for Shetland, and you can keep up with his campaign at http://www.shetlandconversation.com.

The obvious question is, why didn't Mr. Hill pursue his interpretation through the court if he was so sure of it? If he is no longer so sure of it, who has persuaded him to declare independence as a means of circumventing the court process? Surely not the man who, in November last year, was telling the AmRen conference about his dreams for an island off the British coast, where you could have dual citizenship and opportunities for offshore tax havens?

Hartlepool · 23-06-2008, 10:25 AM

I could care less about Mote but hope Mr Hill is successful.

Aardvark/Chikrodha,would you even bother about this topic if Mote wasn't involved in it or on the sidelines?

Aardvark · 23-06-2008, 10:48 AM

Yes I would. Secession is a serious criminal offence and I would want to know, for instance, why Barnby and Burgess are pursuing long dead people for treason, but aren't pursuing traitors who secede.

I'm waiting for some other specific evidence, that I cannot get before Thursday, before I complain to the Attorney General about this attempted secession. A lot of so called patriots are celebrating this unlawful act when they should be condemning it as widely as possible.

I do not want anyone to secede from the union, least of all someone like Mr Hill. We cannot go to the public and present ourselves as normal, patriotic democrats who uphold the rule of law if we support people who seek to dismember the union. Mr Mote uses the word traitor more than most to describe people who he feels have let down our country, he can hardly hold his head up if he secedes, the act of a traitor if ever I saw one.

23-06-2008, 02:45 AM	#2 (permalink)
kiwi ukipper Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Wellington, New Zealand Posts: 68	Perhaps he is looking to advance his political career there once he is ejected from the European Parliament... __________________ "The socialist goal of equality can only be achieved when we all have nothing" Former ACT Party leader, Hon Richard Prebble.

23-06-2008, 07:03 AM	#5 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,565	A declaration of independence should mean entirely that. Mr Hill is not independent and is running a major scam. He cannot generate electricity or purify water or grow sufficient crops to live on. He is not recognised by any other nation in the world. He has no seat at the UN. He hasn't even got a dwelling house on the island and, in an act of non-independence, has applied to the local authority for planning permission to build a house. This act is being greeted with mirth across the political world and supporting it shows a paucity of intellect of monumental precautions. Mr Hill has a few supporters amongst the Barking branch of euroscepticism (sorry I meant barking mad), but nobody of any real power, influence or ability supports him. I would not consider it an honour to be supported by a convicted fraudster and charlatan. Mr Mote was shouted down in the EU Parliament as he tried to lecture people on the rule of law, something for which he apparently cares little as he is not even a tad repentant about being convicted by a jury of his peers of 21 charges (reduced to 20 on appeal) of fraud and theft etc. I assume, gimlet, that you will be paying £275 for a couple of square feet of infertile bog and rubble (8000 x 275 = £2,200,000). The island is worth a couple of grand at most and Mr Hill is going to flog it to 8000 gullible eurosceptics and white supremacists for an absolute fortune. I suspect Mr Mote owns a half share of this rock and is intending to rip off the foolish and terminally insane for their hard earned cash. He and Mr Hill will issue coins and stamps (which anyone can as they are only tokens after all - Lundy did so to sell souvenirs to tourists) and make even more money from very foolish people. For the stamps to have international validity, in that a letter posted on the rock could be forwarded by the Royal Mail, Mr Hill must join the Universal Postal Union. I suspect that they won't let him in. Offshore banks will not fall for Mote's scam as the island, unlike Jersey, Guernsey, Isle of Man (where Mote banks), Caymans, BVI etc is not recognised in international law. Go for it gimlet, support the independence scam and allow the convicted fraudster Mote to live in wealth and opulence whilst you don't. BobFM, Mr Hill is not a Shetlander nor is he Norse, he is a chancer who has bought a lump of rock and is seeking to make a fortune. The Cornish have a different and possible more realistic claim as they are a whole Duchy/Principality. They have a language and culture and history of independence. Shetlands, in its entirety, has belonged to other countries since written records began and is incorporated by the Act of Union into the UK. It was a wedding 'gift'. The Norwegians are not demanding the return of Shetland. Mr Hill is unlikely to have learnt Norwegian for the occasion, although I would be impressed if he had. The island remains within the EU despite Mr Hills best efforts and his 'fish' still belong to the UK and are subject to CFP. Mr Hill has no navy and no means of stopping everyone else from fishing in his waters. Independence. Read the dictionary and get a life. __________________ When in Woking do as the Wokes do. "I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008 Last edited by Aardvark; 23-06-2008 at 07:05 AM.

23-06-2008, 10:48 AM	#10 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,565	Yes I would. Secession is a serious criminal offence and I would want to know, for instance, why Barnby and Burgess are pursuing long dead people for treason, but aren't pursuing traitors who secede. I'm waiting for some other specific evidence, that I cannot get before Thursday, before I complain to the Attorney General about this attempted secession. A lot of so called patriots are celebrating this unlawful act when they should be condemning it as widely as possible. I do not want anyone to secede from the union, least of all someone like Mr Hill. We cannot go to the public and present ourselves as normal, patriotic democrats who uphold the rule of law if we support people who seek to dismember the union. Mr Mote uses the word traitor more than most to describe people who he feels have let down our country, he can hardly hold his head up if he secedes, the act of a traitor if ever I saw one. __________________ When in Woking do as the Wokes do. "I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008

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23-06-2008, 04:59 AM	#3 (permalink)
gimlet Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Shropshire Posts: 802	Excellent news and well done S Hill. Why supporting this move to independance, should be a reflection of someone’s sanity is not clear.

23-06-2008, 06:40 AM	#4 (permalink)
Bob FM Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: South Marston Swindon Posts: 1,119	Sadly eccentrics are perceived by most as being 'thruppence short of a shilling'. There are interesting parallels with those in Cornwall a few years back who claimed independence from the UK.

23-06-2008, 07:25 AM	#6 (permalink)
Bob FM Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: South Marston Swindon Posts: 1,119	So he's not a 'nutter' then

23-06-2008, 10:25 AM	#9 (permalink)
Hartlepool Uber Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: North East England Posts: 6,605 Party: Free England Party	I could care less about Mote but hope Mr Hill is successful. Aardvark/Chikrodha,would you even bother about this topic if Mote wasn't involved in it or on the sidelines?