UKIP Law and Order Conference: John West on Immigration and the Rise in Crime.

Bett Nwar · 03-06-2008, 01:18 PM

chikrodah, Are you stalking me? We keep posting at the same time, but as there are only 2 computers in my office and the bloke on the other is busy with US clients I suspect he's not you.

Internationalist · 03-06-2008, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob FM

Do any of you prolific posters actually have a job.

Prolific posters?

Who could you mean?

Bett Nwar: joined May 2008. 40 posts at 2.55 per day.
chikrodah: joined January 2005. 968 posts at 0.78 per day.
Unionist: joined July 2005. 915 posts at 0.87 per day.
Bob FM: joined March 2008. 123 posts at 1.79 per day.

Admittedly, Bett Nwar has a higher posting rate than you but with only 40 posts on the board it is far too early to call Bett Nwar a prolific poster.

chikrodah and I have very modest totals considering the time we have been on the forum.

You, however, have made a fine start with 123 posts in such a short period of time. Well done.

HULKMAN · 03-06-2008, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chikrodah

Oh lord.

HULKMAN, this is not a UKIP forum. Anybody who posts here is entitled to post on any and all sub-fora including UKIP General Issues.

West, Hudson, et al have all been congratulated for organising, speaking at and attending this conference. I note you weren't vociferous re previous conferences, their speakers and attendees. I wonder why not?

If UKIP genuinely wants nothing but Yes-men who slavishly support the party regardless, could the hierarchy please issue a statement to that effect?

That way, those of us who have already left can stop wondering if UKIP will ever change into the sort of party we'd consider rejoining and those who have stuck with UKIP in the hope of reforming parts of it can give up and leave with good grace, leaving the rest of you to enjoy life.

Many of those who are ex-UKIP have lingering loyalties to the party they thought they'd joined, as opposed to the party that UKIP has shown itself to be. All members of this forum are entitled to express their opinions re UKIP's policies. No UKIP member has the right to want those opinions stifled.

Why on earth does UKIP attract a statistically improbable number of members who cannot cope with even slight cognitive dissonance?

Yet again, we've got the accusation that, somehow, prospective MEPs are being targetted and attacked! Anybody would think you're best friends with fordtit, Legin, Star et al. Really, you're not that important. UKIP MEPs will not attain the success of the 2004 election based on UKIP's current progress. UKIP's unlikely to get even 1 MEP in several of the regions. Members of this forum don't need to do a single thing to make that scenario happen - UKIP's already managed to start itself down that path, much to the distress and shame of a number of ex-UKIPpers.

If people can't cope with debate as a party member, they shouldn't join a political party. Don't come onto a general forum and demand that we discuss things your way or not at all. Find a different hobby, one that doesn't involve interacting with people with differing opinions to your own.

Alternatively, join in the debate. Defend your corner, not with spin and vague generalities but with supporting links to the references and statistics you rely upon. That way you earn both yourself and your party some respect.

As I said I am sick and tired of people on this forum attacking those members who are prepared to do something to get us out of the EU. As for other conferences, I have attended many and have always enjoyed them regardless of what certain posters have said about them. The Troxy event was excellent with Nigel on great form. When you have put in the hard work that people like Nigel, Chris, John, Gerard and all the others do then perhaps people will have the right to attack them.

At least they are all prepared to put their heads above the trenches and fight for what they believe in. Unlike many on this forum.

chikrodah · 03-06-2008, 02:06 PM

Bett, no I'm not stalking you. Perish the thought! It must be natural synchronicity.

Unionist, I couldn't have put it better myself.

HULKMAN · 03-06-2008, 02:12 PM

People should also note that in an official UKIP leaflet it stated one in seven inmates is a foreigner. I was sent an email with the various designs. If I remember it was either the crime leaflet or the immigration leaflet (one with the cartoon). If people have a problem with that perhaps they should contact Head Office. We can't ignore facts even if many would on this forum.

Michael Heaver · 03-06-2008, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HULKMAN

As I said I am sick and tired of people on this forum attacking those members who are prepared to do something to get us out of the EU. As for other conferences, I have attended many and have always enjoyed them regardless of what certain posters have said about them. The Troxy event was excellent with Nigel on great form. When you have put in the hard work that people like Nigel, Chris, John, Gerard and all the others do then perhaps people will have the right to attack them.

I'd agree with that.

HULKMAN · 03-06-2008, 02:22 PM

David Campbell Bannerman also spoke at the law conference. Will people be attacking him for giving it his support? I know he is seen as a liberal UKIP member and was a former member of the Bow Group ( a left wing Tory pressure group) but he was still prepared to support it.

From feedback I hear that all the speeches were excellent. Paul Nuttal, John West, Gerard Batten and Rob Burberry were very, very good. Paul and John gave very strong speeches on there topics. David Campbell Bannerman and David Fraser were also good.

Alex McKee · 03-06-2008, 02:28 PM

No-one is attacking John or Christopher. We are simply pointing out that making speeches generalizing all immigrants as criminals is not sensible & not accurate.

mkpdavies · 03-06-2008, 03:47 PM

The fact is UKIP has banged on about immigration big time for a long time now.

At the 2005 GE, that is all UKIP talked about. It has to be careful and tactful and not blow the issue up and seem obsessed with it.

Sorry, but that is exactly how the party comes across and is why it still barely scrapes 1% in polls.

Legin · 03-06-2008, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Heaver

While I do applaud John West and Chris Hudson for setting up the conference and thank them allowing me to speak there, I do feel the day was too focused on the issue of the EU and immigration as opposed to law and order as a purely domestic policy.

Wait until it comes out on YouTube and then we can all make our own judgements.

Who put you up to write this Michael?? Not your dearly beloved (Joke) leader I hope!! Once posted a retraction is TOO late!!

03-06-2008, 02:28 PM	#58 (permalink)
Alex McKee Moderator Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Gloucester Posts: 6,666	No-one is attacking John or Christopher. We are simply pointing out that making speeches generalizing all immigrants as criminals is not sensible & not accurate. __________________ Anything I post on this web forum is my personal opinion only. Users on Ignore list: None.

03-06-2008, 03:47 PM	#59 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 32,059 Party: Libertarian Party	The fact is UKIP has banged on about immigration big time for a long time now. At the 2005 GE, that is all UKIP talked about. It has to be careful and tactful and not blow the issue up and seem obsessed with it. Sorry, but that is exactly how the party comes across and is why it still barely scrapes 1% in polls. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Lib Dems

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03-06-2008, 01:18 PM	#51 (permalink)
Bett Nwar Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 210	chikrodah, Are you stalking me? We keep posting at the same time, but as there are only 2 computers in my office and the bloke on the other is busy with US clients I suspect he's not you.

03-06-2008, 02:06 PM	#54 (permalink)
chikrodah Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Midlands Posts: 1,872	Bett, no I'm not stalking you. Perish the thought! It must be natural synchronicity. Unionist, I couldn't have put it better myself.

03-06-2008, 02:12 PM	#55 (permalink)
HULKMAN Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 92	People should also note that in an official UKIP leaflet it stated one in seven inmates is a foreigner. I was sent an email with the various designs. If I remember it was either the crime leaflet or the immigration leaflet (one with the cartoon). If people have a problem with that perhaps they should contact Head Office. We can't ignore facts even if many would on this forum.

03-06-2008, 02:22 PM	#57 (permalink)
HULKMAN Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 92	David Campbell Bannerman also spoke at the law conference. Will people be attacking him for giving it his support? I know he is seen as a liberal UKIP member and was a former member of the Bow Group ( a left wing Tory pressure group) but he was still prepared to support it. From feedback I hear that all the speeches were excellent. Paul Nuttal, John West, Gerard Batten and Rob Burberry were very, very good. Paul and John gave very strong speeches on there topics. David Campbell Bannerman and David Fraser were also good.