C_steam

Then honesty is required. If the one and only purpose of UKIP is 'to get our country back' (and it should be) then there is no point AT ALL in messing about with policy on any other subject. Instead, what is needed is a clear vision of how disengagement from the EU should be achieved, and exit strategy if you like, the measurable benefits this brings, as well as loads of data on how the eu affects our lives daily, with real numbers and concise precis of correct and unarguable facts. If this were the case, then the whole BOO thing makes sense.

On the other hand, if UKIP is trying to be a full policy alternative to the liblabcon, then the BOO thing is flawed.

This is the issue (policy party or 'pressure' party) which runs on and on through UKIP's history and has not yet been succesfully laid to rest.

One way or another, I think clarity is required.

C_steam

@ tom:-

Agreed, but I feel this is the thin end of the wedge.

from Nigel's letter:-
I think it really odd to not fight eurosceptic MP's, but to stand against other proven eurosceptic PPC's, who surely also must be 'real allies'?

eublues

This is all trying to be too tidy.

We need to do what we are currently doing.

That is, continuing to develop as a party with a full manifesto, while continuing to campaign to get the UK out of the EU by all possible means in a pragmatic spirit.

Mikeuk

Britannist's posts record important background information on what may be going on behind the scenes at the Telegraph.

I have the impression that if the Barclay Brothers are prepared to tone down some of the attacks on Cameron they may expect the party to make a rightward move in return. Insofar as we know anything about their views they are believed to be 'Thatcherite'.

EUBlues is right that we must take a pragmatic line. By making alliances with Eurosceptics in other parties we vcan punch well above our weight.

Unfortunately there are still many in UKIP who want to maintain a kind of ideological purity which is actually unhelpful to the anti-EU cause.

C_steam

well, that's the nub, isn't it Mike? Do you want a 'proper' party or do you want a tory light majoring on EU withdrawal? At the moment you have neither. Or, if you believe you have the latter, where is the cutting edge?, apart from Nigel's media attempts, in which latterly he has not done so well.

If Nigel (god forbid) was knocked over by a bus tomorrow who is capable and waiting in the wings?

Andrew Constantine

Both my family and my wife's were very strongly pro-Tory. Both families have now seen the light on the overwhelming role of the EU and the anti-English policies of all three major parties. I suspect if these famies are at all representataive, then the Tories are due a kicking at the next General Election.

What I am not sure of is who will be the beneficaries of the Tories parting company with their tradational supporters. With the FPTP system, I assume it will be - in England at least - the other two main parties.

Of course if UKIP and the English Democrats got their act together with a tough minded anti-EU campaign, (showing the voters how much the EU costs per head and all its other consequences on our democracy and society) and arguing for a fairer settlement for England within the Union, we would have the chance at least of mobilising sufficient support to gain some MPs.

Andrew Constantine

g hall

If the tories under boy dave do become euro sceptic (unlikely but) then what happens to the voters who switched from the Tories, UKIP must develop policies and furthermore it must be seen as being more then a one man band otherwise it becomes like Respect or Gravitas knock out the leader and you're stuffed

C_steam

Precisely. It has to be one or the other, UKIP can't try to be all things to all people.

kernow

You may or may not have noticed since Nigel became leader he has been broadening the issues discussed and has not just yapped on about the EU. In my opinion committed Tories who have taken the leap of faith are not likely to backtrack especially as Nigel is keen to discuss issues other than just leaving the EU. Seeing as Dave has **** in their nest twice, once when back tracking on pulling the Tories out of the Pro EU grouping in Brussels and twice when back tracking over getting back Britain's fishing rights, I don't think the Tories who do make the leap of faith will back track hoping that It's third time lucky!

Ted Bovis

End of UKIP, methinks. The Tories have got us now.