UKIP former Gosport Chairman joins LibDems

Mikeuk · 08-12-2006, 08:32 AM

I was very disappointed to read that John Bowles, who was a very active worker for UKIP, has joined the LibDem and hopes to stand as a candidate in the town council elections next year.

John was a tireless worker for UKIP, a parliamentary candidate in the last General Election, and a regular anti-EU stallholder in Gosport High Street. Knowing his views on a number of sensitive issues if somebody told me he had defected to another party and asked me to guess which one, I would have suggested something other than LibDem! :twisted:

Apparently the momentous issue of town centre parking charges has caused this defection.

Aardvark · 08-12-2006, 08:56 AM

This looks like somebody looking at the 'art of the achievable'. As a LibDim councillor, if elected, Mr Bowles could actually affect car parking charges. As a UKIP PPC he has discovered that he can change nothing.

The current UKIP leadership is not going to help Mr Bowles get elected in 3.5 years time if ever. There is no sense of urgency. NF will be content to hold on to some EU seats and save a few deposits at the GE. He's no intention of standing candidates in some of the most eurosceptic constituencies in the country for fear of upsetting BOO. The latest ploy is not to get our own candidates elected, but to spend thousands of pounds writing to the other parties' successfully elected councillors etc and trying to persuade them to join UKIP. This shows how out of touch head office is. Why would someone spend years working to get themselves elected as Lab/Con/Lib/etc only to throw it all away to join UKIP on the basis of one letter. Most councillors work in towns and cities that have small or non-existent UKIP branches. If they resigned and joined UKIP they would cut themselves off from long term friendships and working partnerships to find themselves being invited to start from scratch to create a branch with no support whatsoever from head office. When you see councillor's allowances in some authorities it takes a lot to walk away from 10 grand to be the only UKIP candidate for next May's wipe out.

Mike, what will John Bowles receive if elected to your local council (assuming that it'snot town/parish he's going for)? What would NF expect him to spend if he stood for Parliament again - deposit, leaflets etc?

It's a sad fact that if UKIP leadership don't get a bandwagon rolling soon then we are more likely to leave the EU because of it's own implosion or structural weakness that for any reason associated with UKIP's success.

SponPlague · 08-12-2006, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aardvark

Why would someone spend years working to get themselves elected as Lab/Con/Lib/etc only to throw it all away to join UKIP on the basis of one letter.

Good question, but I'm delighted to confirm that they are jumping ship to us:

Quote:

The Times 8th December 2006

Anthony Browne

Chief Political Correspondent

He joined the Conservatives 40 years ago and fought a number of elections for the party he loved, taking on Tony Blair in Sedgefield in 1983. He was constituency chairman to William Hague, when he was in the Cabinet and the party’s leader.

But the Tory party’s recent embrace of the left-wing columnist Polly Toynbee has stretched Toby Horton’s loyalty beyond breaking point.

In the most high-profile of a wave of defections that is shaking the party leadership, Mr Hague’s former constituency chairman has resigned from the Conservative Party and joined the United Kingdom Independence Party. Other defections include a local party chairman and another former parliamentary candidate.

Conservative MPs said that these were warning shots across the bows of David Cameron’s campaign to take the party to the centre ground, and declared that many more defections were likely. UKIP is hailing the defections as proof that it is now the true party of the Centre Right.

“I didn’t leave the Conservative Party, the Conservative Party has left me,” Mr Horton said yesterday at his home in Mr Blair’s constituency. “There is a real need in this country for a party of the Centre Right, and if the Conservative Party doesn’t want to fill it, there is inevitably a vacuum that UKIP will fill. If you want to vote green, there is a thriving Green Party. If you want to vote Liberal Democrat, there is a thriving Liberal Democrat Party.”

Mr Horton’s frustration has been building as Mr Cameron has tried to shed the party’s “nasty” image by ditching its past, focusing on issues such as the environment and social justice, and promising to show love to louts. But the final straw for Mr Horton came last month when the party embraced Ms Toynbee, who has made a career out of attacking all things right-wing. A Conservative policy review suggested that the party adopt her views on poverty rather than Winston Churchill’s, and Mr Cameron suggested that she would be invited to next year’s party conference.

“There was a Polly Toynbee moment — that was the tipping point,” said Mr Horton, who met Mr Cameron at the hustings during his leadership campaign.

He gave warning that many people would follow him. “It will become increasingly common. Most Conservatives are instinctively loyal, but there’s always a tipping point.”

The defection of such long-serving and high-profile Conservatives has caused alarm among the party’s MPs. One said: “This is undoubtedly a warning shot. Many people tempted to join UKIP are cast-iron Conservatives, but they must feel they have something to vote for. It is essential we keep on board traditional Tories.”

Another defector is Mark Hudson, 36, a vice-president of the Bank of America, who was president and chairman of the Sevenoaks Conservative Association in Kent, and on the official Conservative candidates’ list.

“The way Cameron has led the party means I can’t be part of it, and there’s lots of people like me,” he said. “He’s turned it into something indistinguishable from new Labour, so what’s the point?” Kevin Davidson Hall, a former Conservative candidate in Peterborough, has also defected, declaring: “UKIP are now the only voice of opposition in this country, speaking up for all those who feel betrayed by the other parties.”

Nigel Farage, the UKIP leader, said: “These activists know it makes no difference who wins the election — their manifestos are pretty much identical.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...9-2493164.html

kernow · 08-12-2006, 11:17 AM

A UKIP supporter joining the Lib Dems! :shock: On the surface he may well have been a "Keen" activist but he has to be a pretty shallow individual to leave UKIP and join the Lib Dems over the "pretence" of having more chance of altering car park charges. There are many of us trying to save our Country and this chap is giving up that fight to join our enemy to help get cheaper car parking charges in his area! I do not believe him, he's just looking for a bit of power in my opinion and thinks the local Lib Dems are the way of getting it. I wonder what he'll do with the "30 pieces of silver"! :x

prober · 08-12-2006, 12:58 PM

Aarvark is right. There is no sign yet of any interest centrally at the top in raising UKIP's branch capability to tackle local elections, or giving them the basic tools to fight them above the dog **** and graffitti level. Unless unworldly or a visionary why should other UKIP issue sympathetic councillors risk defecting to a local shell or basket case ? The assumption that UKIP can do without involved grassroots and viable branches but ONLY seek added value from outsiders does not bode well. Horsham.

mkpdavies · 08-12-2006, 02:57 PM

I hope he is a covert ops type of guy. :twisted:

This-England · 08-12-2006, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kernow

A UKIP supporter joining the Lib Dems! :shock: On the surface he may well have been a "Keen" activist but he has to be a pretty shallow individual to leave UKIP and join the Lib Dems over the "pretence" of having more chance of altering car park charges. There are many of us trying to save our Country and this chap is giving up that fight to join our enemy to help get cheaper car parking charges in his area! I do not believe him, he's just looking for a bit of power in my opinion and thinks the local Lib Dems are the way of getting it. I wonder what he'll do with the "30 pieces of silver"! :x

Apart from the European issue their is little between your two parties so its understanable.

Soddball · 08-12-2006, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by This-England

Quote:

Originally Posted by kernow

A UKIP supporter joining the Lib Dems! :shock: On the surface he may well have been a "Keen" activist but he has to be a pretty shallow individual to leave UKIP and join the Lib Dems over the "pretence" of having more chance of altering car park charges. There are many of us trying to save our Country and this chap is giving up that fight to join our enemy to help get cheaper car parking charges in his area! I do not believe him, he's just looking for a bit of power in my opinion and thinks the local Lib Dems are the way of getting it. I wonder what he'll do with the "30 pieces of silver"! :x

Apart from the European issue their is little between your two parties so its understanable.

Apart from the tax, welfare, NHS, business, immigration, nuclear power and environmental issues?

Come on.

jim h · 08-12-2006, 04:32 PM

This -England must have his head buried in the sand or has never read a Lib Dum manifesto !!

This-England · 08-12-2006, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soddball

Quote:

Originally Posted by This-England

Quote:

Originally Posted by kernow

A UKIP supporter joining the Lib Dems! :shock: On the surface he may well have been a "Keen" activist but he has to be a pretty shallow individual to leave UKIP and join the Lib Dems over the "pretence" of having more chance of altering car park charges. There are many of us trying to save our Country and this chap is giving up that fight to join our enemy to help get cheaper car parking charges in his area! I do not believe him, he's just looking for a bit of power in my opinion and thinks the local Lib Dems are the way of getting it. I wonder what he'll do with the "30 pieces of silver"! :x

Apart from the European issue their is little between your two parties so its understanable.

Apart from the tax, welfare, NHS, business, immigration, nuclear power and environmental issues?

Come on.

In what way are you different on Welfare or Nuclear Power?

Your both pro-Immigration parties, both oppose Corporal and Capital Punishment, Both support Free Trade, Both support NATO, Both support Privatisation, I could go on.

08-12-2006, 08:32 AM	#1 (permalink)
Mikeuk Banned Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Fareham Posts: 5,758 Party: Conservatives	UKIP former Gosport Chairman joins LibDems I was very disappointed to read that John Bowles, who was a very active worker for UKIP, has joined the LibDem and hopes to stand as a candidate in the town council elections next year. John was a tireless worker for UKIP, a parliamentary candidate in the last General Election, and a regular anti-EU stallholder in Gosport High Street. Knowing his views on a number of sensitive issues if somebody told me he had defected to another party and asked me to guess which one, I would have suggested something other than LibDem! :twisted: Apparently the momentous issue of town centre parking charges has caused this defection.

08-12-2006, 02:57 PM	#6 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,053 Party: Libertarian Party	I hope he is a covert ops type of guy. :twisted: __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

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08-12-2006, 08:56 AM	#2 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,973	This looks like somebody looking at the 'art of the achievable'. As a LibDim councillor, if elected, Mr Bowles could actually affect car parking charges. As a UKIP PPC he has discovered that he can change nothing. The current UKIP leadership is not going to help Mr Bowles get elected in 3.5 years time if ever. There is no sense of urgency. NF will be content to hold on to some EU seats and save a few deposits at the GE. He's no intention of standing candidates in some of the most eurosceptic constituencies in the country for fear of upsetting BOO. The latest ploy is not to get our own candidates elected, but to spend thousands of pounds writing to the other parties' successfully elected councillors etc and trying to persuade them to join UKIP. This shows how out of touch head office is. Why would someone spend years working to get themselves elected as Lab/Con/Lib/etc only to throw it all away to join UKIP on the basis of one letter. Most councillors work in towns and cities that have small or non-existent UKIP branches. If they resigned and joined UKIP they would cut themselves off from long term friendships and working partnerships to find themselves being invited to start from scratch to create a branch with no support whatsoever from head office. When you see councillor's allowances in some authorities it takes a lot to walk away from 10 grand to be the only UKIP candidate for next May's wipe out. Mike, what will John Bowles receive if elected to your local council (assuming that it'snot town/parish he's going for)? What would NF expect him to spend if he stood for Parliament again - deposit, leaflets etc? It's a sad fact that if UKIP leadership don't get a bandwagon rolling soon then we are more likely to leave the EU because of it's own implosion or structural weakness that for any reason associated with UKIP's success.

08-12-2006, 11:17 AM	#4 (permalink)
kernow Uber Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 5,182	A UKIP supporter joining the Lib Dems! :shock: On the surface he may well have been a "Keen" activist but he has to be a pretty shallow individual to leave UKIP and join the Lib Dems over the "pretence" of having more chance of altering car park charges. There are many of us trying to save our Country and this chap is giving up that fight to join our enemy to help get cheaper car parking charges in his area! I do not believe him, he's just looking for a bit of power in my opinion and thinks the local Lib Dems are the way of getting it. I wonder what he'll do with the "30 pieces of silver"! :x

08-12-2006, 12:58 PM	#5 (permalink)
prober Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 854	Aarvark is right. There is no sign yet of any interest centrally at the top in raising UKIP's branch capability to tackle local elections, or giving them the basic tools to fight them above the dog **** and graffitti level. Unless unworldly or a visionary why should other UKIP issue sympathetic councillors risk defecting to a local shell or basket case ? The assumption that UKIP can do without involved grassroots and viable branches but ONLY seek added value from outsiders does not bode well. Horsham.

08-12-2006, 04:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
jim h Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 361	This -England must have his head buried in the sand or has never read a Lib Dum manifesto !!