What Nigel Says He Will Do & What UKIP Needs to Do

Lewkip · 09-10-2006, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkpdavies

UKIP has to attract members and money before it can do the fight elections bit propperly.

That's where the central organisation is most important, as the local side needs something to sell.

The beebs "Have Your Say" shows there is a market for UKIP's policies, so UKIP has to show that it is going somewhere and is run professionally.

Look at the Lib Dems, they get everything handed to them on a plate from central office. They have a focused and unified strategy and effectivley us templates of success.

UKIP should have the same, only with sensible policies on a national level.

I can see why you say that but this year in Lewisham the LibDems were strong in some areas, weak in others. Nationally, they were pants. If we follow your line, the LibDems would have tanked. Their strength is at the grassroots level and when they put their minds to it, are formidable.

Are they superior to UKIP activists in this regard? Are they more intelligent? Absolutely not. They know that all politics is local and work consistently at it. It is up to us to learn from those that have success and equally those that fail.

Waiting for `national direction' is a recipe for disaster. An afternoon spent on Google in a ward of your choice to come up with hot topics for 5,000 £50 risograph leaflets that will be handed out in the high street the following week will do far more than looking for Nigel to help you out.

mkpdavies · 09-10-2006, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Their strength is at the grassroots level and when they put their minds to it, are formidable.

The reason for this is they are organised.

UKIP are not. Thus some areas will do will, but most will flounder.

An army needs direction, UKIP fight more like insurgents. Everyone doing their own thing, nothing coordinated, nothing put on a plate to make it easy for people.

With just a tiny bit of organisation and lead from the centre, people might start feeling like they have a chance, are not alone and know where they are heading.

Every branch should be given an election fighting pack. It should include software with templates for everything, including newspapers, leaflets, letter formats. Resources for printing, advertising, etc etc should be made at ultra low cost to all. A private website for UKIP members should be available alerting people to events, organising campaigns.

Give the local branches the tools and they will have a chance. Then success will breed more success and new members and money will follow.

Sorry but just telling people to get out there and fight isn't enough and it is whay UKIP membership is falling at a time when it should be soaring.

kernow · 09-10-2006, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soddball

IMO, pointing the finger at the EU and saying 'Them furriners changed your refuse collection' won't turn heads on a local level. Spending your life pointing out the evils of the EU probably won't win you much support at a national level, either.
People will want to know why you're going to make their town better. You could point to increased accountability, more local/direct democracy, solving problems with graffiti/litter/crime/drugs, reducing council tax and so on.

I've always voted for the same party locally as I have Nationally never bothering to see what they stand for locally and I bet if people are honest I do not stand alone on this one!

Lewkip · 09-10-2006, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkpdavies

Quote:

Their strength is at the grassroots level and when they put their minds to it, are formidable.

The reason for this is they are organised.

UKIP are not. Thus some areas will do will, but most will flounder.

An army needs direction, UKIP fight more like insurgents. Everyone doing their own thing, nothing coordinated, nothing put on a plate to make it easy for people.

With just a tiny bit of organisation and lead from the centre, people might start feeling like they have a chance, are not alone and know where they are heading.

Every branch should be given an election fighting pack. It should include software with templates for everything, including newspapers, leaflets, letter formats. Resources for printing, advertising, etc etc should be made at ultra low cost to all. A private website for UKIP members should be available alerting people to events, organising campaigns.

Give the local branches the tools and they will have a chance. Then success will breed more success and new members and money will follow.

Sorry but just telling people to get out there and fight isn't enough and it is whay UKIP membership is falling at a time when it should be soaring.

I see no reason in this post to change my mind. Nothing listed here is beyond the scope of grassroots people to carry out for themselves. I cannot see the material difference that UKIP National can offer that cannot be done on the ground. I will go further to say that this is probably being used as an excuse to not try.

Templates, newsletter formats, private websites etc can be either found or created for free. Some of our fellow regions have been known to offer cut-price printing, even non-political UKIP-friendly outfits have been known to offer discounted printing services.

C'mon, is it really this hard? I don't think so.

mkpdavies · 09-10-2006, 04:18 PM

O.K, we'll see how your head in the sand approach works.

SponPlague · 09-10-2006, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kernow

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soddball

IMO, pointing the finger at the EU and saying 'Them furriners changed your refuse collection' won't turn heads on a local level. Spending your life pointing out the evils of the EU probably won't win you much support at a national level, either.
People will want to know why you're going to make their town better. You could point to increased accountability, more local/direct democracy, solving problems with graffiti/litter/crime/drugs, reducing council tax and so on.

I've always voted for the same party locally as I have Nationally never bothering to see what they stand for locally and I bet if people are honest I do not stand alone on this one!

When I stood for the council, one of my members obkected to my policy of speed bumps being good (we get noisy car racers in Guildford) and said he'd support us nationally, but not me locally. I'd thought it would be a populr stance - anti noisy drivers, but not with this member... It's not always that easy to predict what will sell locally...

mkpdavies · 09-10-2006, 04:28 PM

You'd have lost my vote there too.

Bluemerle · 09-10-2006, 04:31 PM

Trevor Colman has an excellent poster and leaflet campaign going in the South West. Every month he produces a new poster, together with a leaflet which is distributed locally. I forget how many enquiries Lexdrum House has had, but on the 6th September, they had had over 2000 enquiries with 60 new members.

This was the first one:- http://www.letsgovernourselves.com/

BUT, the point is that Nigel would not let this be rolled out across the country. He was very reluctant to allow it to be trialled in the South West.

SO, what is he going to do to get the ball rolling??? What are his ideas for bringing in new members??? He is very good at dismissing any bright ideas, but he doesn't come up with anything in their place.

Lewkip · 09-10-2006, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkpdavies

O.K, we'll see how your head in the sand approach works.

Head in the sand? I'm arguing for full-on activism on my high street, taking the core message of UKIP and making it relevant to fellow residents. Researching all 54 councillors in my borough to see what makes them tick and all 18 wards and three constituencies to get a better feel for the borough's identity. How on earth is that putting my head in the sand?

I am not advocating the tail wagging the dog - but I believe criticism is more valuable when sourced from credibility. As far as I can see, there is nothing stopping me from doing what I want. I don't need permission from Newton Abbot on how to spread the message. I gladly take any counsel or advice on offer as long as it furthers my aims in the borough, the rest, I'll ignore.

Do you think Martin Luther King Jnr. waited for the Baptist church to approve his activities? Did Marcus Garvey ask for permission before setting up the United Negro Improvement Association in the teeth of virulent and extreme American racism nearly 100 years ago? Did Malcolm X have to wait for the Nation of Islam to become its best recruiter?

If these men could flourish in far more trying times than we are currently in, then all of us at the very least should be functioning on par with Steve Allison in Hartlepool.

We really have to stop the whinging and get on with it!

Bluemerle · 09-10-2006, 04:38 PM

Quote:

We really have to stop the whinging and get on with it!

What tools are you being provided with to get things rolling? Have you got any new leaflets? Not the old ones about "No to the EU", but new ones about what the political parties are up to here in Britain, how Labour are destroying our country etc?

09-10-2006, 04:18 PM	#25 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,053 Party: Libertarian Party	O.K, we'll see how your head in the sand approach works. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

09-10-2006, 04:28 PM	#27 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,053 Party: Libertarian Party	You'd have lost my vote there too. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

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09-10-2006, 04:31 PM	#28 (permalink)
Bluemerle Uber Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Dorset. Posts: 3,252	Trevor Colman has an excellent poster and leaflet campaign going in the South West. Every month he produces a new poster, together with a leaflet which is distributed locally. I forget how many enquiries Lexdrum House has had, but on the 6th September, they had had over 2000 enquiries with 60 new members. This was the first one:- http://www.letsgovernourselves.com/ BUT, the point is that Nigel would not let this be rolled out across the country. He was very reluctant to allow it to be trialled in the South West. SO, what is he going to do to get the ball rolling??? What are his ideas for bringing in new members??? He is very good at dismissing any bright ideas, but he doesn't come up with anything in their place.