ukpatriot

Aardvark is spot on in his post above.

It indeed looks as though Israel wants to antagonise its Arab neighbours, to maintain the tension in the Middle East, and why is this?

Could it be to ensure the continuation of US economic and military aid which dwarfs that given to any other nation on earth?

Could it be that it allows Israel to attempt to justify the illegal occupation of the West Bank and a stranglehold over Gaza, all the time constructing ever more Jewish settlements in the West Bank and strengthening its claim to the West Bank as a part of Greater Israel? It seems to be working when we hear Bush talking about a solution to the issue as one which will be decided based on the 'facts on the ground' as opposed to the internationally recognised borders of Israel and the West Bank? If so, it is a theft on a massive scale.

Or could it be that Israel wants to provoke certain Arab neighbours into attacking it, so it can beat them in battle and occupy their territory as well? After all, many Israelis would like to occupy Jordan as part of 'Greater Israel'...

Israel can do what it likes just as long as it received shedloads of US aid and all the weapons it wants, and the Israeli lobby is very powerful in the USA and apparently in Britain too, where a Labour Government, of all things, supports Israeli atrocities and aggression.

It's time we stopped supporting the USA and Israel and remade our relationships with the Arab world, and looked East to build alliances which will strengthen world peace and oppose US-Israeli aggression.

Aardvark

Note for our Secret Service man with the special job - the Buccaneer in 1991 was not equipped with the same sophisticated targetting equipment that the F-16 has. Unsurprisingly there have been substantial advances in technology in the last 15 years.

There has been little change in tactics. If you can't see the target you don't shoot!!!! Those of us who have served in the military know that randomly firing or dropping bombs is inneffective unless you have complete disregard for the populace you are bombing or shooting at (as was the situation in WWII where total war was under way). The Israeli fighter pilot should not have released a missile in an area where the UN had already asked several times for firing to cease if he could not lock on his target (which was?).

The truth is that, with modern targetting systems, the Israelis did deliberately destroy a UN building. This is now making it harder to get an international force put together to establish a peace keeping body in southern Lebanon since several nations don't trust the Israelis not to kill their soldiers. This means that peace is further away.

I'm not sure that I would want to rely for my life on the bunch of cowboys that constitutes the current Israeli armed forces. One third of the Lebanese dead are children. I know GAriss and Mike Hillier that you probably see 200 dead children as fair fall out from the Israeli attacks - they're only Arabs after all!

Let's face it, Mike, if you think a nuclear strike with 50,000 dead is fair recompense for 8 dead and 2 captured, you clearly have no care how many Arab children die. As it is, if the wind was in the wrong direction on the day of the strike the radiation would make large parts of Israel uninhabitable for years (no doubt this would be the excuse to invade eretz Israel and expel all Arabs west of the Jordan River and from western Jordan to create lebensraum).

The problem is that there are people in Israel who probably also believe that a nuke is the answer. Israel may take us all into WWIII yet. I just pray that my country is not on their side.

Clippo

Some of the previous posters on this topic are getting pretty steamed up and, in effect, verbally perpetuating the 'war' on the forum.

Like Matt said earlier this is a hard one for many people to decide on.
It seems to me that both sides have strong arguments to support their actions but like the real Arab -Israeli conflict (of which this is round xxx), no one side has intellectual superiority. Similarly, force by either side isn't going to solve this one. Although the Israelis are probably militarily stronger and backed by the US, the nature of war has changed and Hezbollah & probably Hamas are increasingly well supplied by Syria/Iran and Russia

Petrina said quite rightly that the pictures were 'ghastly' but obviously this website is a pro-arab organisation and therefore almost certainly propagandic. Has anybody on the forum looked to see if the Israelis have published pictures of their victims or should we look to see what Islamic fundamentalists have done in Iraq or even London?

I'm not condoning any of it from either side. To me, the only solution is first an immediate cease-fire. Secondly, (very quickly), disarming of Hezbollah in Lebanon, and then get the diplomats at work. I was going to add a beefed up UN force in S. Lebanon but history of the last 40-50years has shown UN forces to be pathetically ineffective in such conflicts. - some might say that in this latest war UN forces are partly responsible by allowing Hezbollah to entrench in S. Lebanon.

So, although I find it very difficult to swallow my pride, I have to agree with Tony Blair on this one. I think, US poodle or not, he was one of the first statesmen of the G8 to call for an immediate ceasefire.

Matt Davies said many months ago that this particular forum had long given up being a purely UKIP policy/suggestion one and BB's initialising post was indeed more of a question. Some have said UKIP should not respond - I disagree. To build a credibility as a serious political party (and thus to attract sensible voters), UKIP must comment on as much as it possibly can. UKIP needs sensible publicity !!!

In this case, taking the middle ground - (ceasefire then diplomacy) would have lost UKIP nothing - rather they may have gained a lot!

Mikeuk

You're absolutely right. We need an immediate ceasefire and UKIP should be right up there calling for it.

True, Blair has lately shown a little more sensitivity, but note the deafening silence from Cameron and the pro-Israel noises from his rabid friends in the press such as Charles Moore and Dan Dan the Lavatory Man D'Ancona.

Time to target these hate-crazed Tory warmongering racists and make it clear that Cameron is one of them.

ukpatriot

That's because the Tories are right in there supporting everything Israel does no matter how atrocious, and 80% of their MPs are members of CFI. Moore and Bogman are monkeys dancing to the organ grinder's tune.... and who is paying the organ grinder?

Yeah it is about time the Tories were exposed as uncritical supporters of Israeli aggression, so that the voters can tell them what they think of them on polling day.

Mikeuk

Still, one really devastating piece in the Telegraph

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...27/wmid127.xml

Israel's bloody onslaught seen as recipe for losing friends and alienating people

Prof. Anthony King analyses UK opinion on the crisis. It's time for people-power to sweep aside the warmongering monkeys and bring true democracy to bear on the situation.

An early coup within the Labour Party could set the scene for much-needed change.

ukpatriot

More bad news today from Lebanon as the number of innocent people, many of them children younger than ten, rises because of Israeli attacks. The IDF, as the Israeli Chief of Staff said recently, is trying to blast Lebanon back 20 years.

The Israelis are committing war crimes and nothing is being done about it.

The UN and the entire world have condemned the Israeli attacks on Lebanon and called for a ceasefire while the US regime, Tony Blair and the Tories have to varying degrees... Blair being the mildest... supported Israeli activities.

It's time to ask why Tony Blair, almost the entire Tory Party, and the USA are so at odds with world opinion on this latest Israeli aggression. What or who is it which has led them to support Israeli atrocities and war crimes?

Meanwhile, the British Foreign Office has protested at the USA's shipping of bombs through Prestwick destined for Israel while Israel's usual allies in the press, Bogman, Moore and their friends in the Daily Telegraph, have supported the US action. What a surprise. Who's pulling their strings?

Imagine the reaction of the USA, media etc if weapons were being shipped through Prestwick to Iran or Syria? There would be fury.

Whilst the eyes of the world's media have focused on the tragedy unfolding in the Lebanon, it has been overlooked that once again Israel has invaded Gaza and is murdering Palestinians and demolishing Palestinian homes.

When will the UK stand up and say 'Enough is enough! We want no more part in supporting US-Israeli aggression'?

Mikeuk

At the Shoreham hustings I asked all four candidates if they would speak out on Lebanon.

All four called for an immediate ceasefire.

Although I will not be voting for Mr Noakes, he is to be commended for condemning the Americans and Israelis outright as the 'warmongers' they most certainly are.

Rosie

So when enemies are firing rockets into the UK because they have 'vowed to exterminate England', will Mike have a problem with that?

Independent UKIP

I think Hezbollah are firing rockets today because of what Israel is doing today. I think Hezbollah know that Israel cannot be exterminated. I therefore, with reference to earlier posts, disagree with you on this issue.