Behind every great man, there's a great woman.

mkpdavies · 20-07-2006, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Now, there was a time,
when they used to say,
that behind ev'ry great man,
there had to be a great woman.
But oh, in these times of change,
you know that it's no longer true.
So we're comin' out of the kitchen,
'cause there's something we forgot to say to you.
We say, Sisters are doin' it for themselves,

The Eurythmics' song - Sisters Are Doin' It For Themselves:

During presidential elections, it is often part of the procedure to give the 1st lady to be a bit of attention, as many people believe a stong lady behind a man in charge is essential.

I know very little about the women behind the men in this contest. How about a run down?

progcon.org · 20-07-2006, 10:07 AM

I think as we have seen from the Blairs - the less we see of partners the better. We vote for an individual not a couple.

mkpdavies · 20-07-2006, 10:09 AM

I don't. If we had known more about Blairs money grabbing wife, then perhaps we would never have voted Blair and saved this country from his dictatorship.

It's important.

I know Nigel is married to a German, but likes the odd away fixture.

progcon.org · 20-07-2006, 10:35 AM

But how to you square their political outlooks? What if the candidate is small government but their partner not?

Husbands and wives often have very different politics. Our job is to judge the candidates on their stated agenda, not whether they are straight, gay, single, married, faithful, unfaithful.

We are seeking to be a small government libertarian party, and we should avoid Tory moralising.

If Richard/Nigel is secretly banging a 18 year-old boy, or whether he is a church-going man who has only ever shagged one woman, his wife, means nothing to me.

I want to know if he can do the job, not who he is doing.

If the Ski supporters lower this contest into moralising, low level personal attacks, it will make it difficult to heal the wounds later. We are all in the same party, don't seek to destroy any candidate as UKIP will be the loser.

mkpdavies · 20-07-2006, 10:50 AM

I want to know a bit about them. Doesn't mean I'm going to moralise on everything, but if one of them is like Mark Oaten, cheater, user of rent boys, likes rolling around in *****.

Then I want the chance to reject them.

I accept Nigel likes the odd away fixture. Not great, but wouldn't stop me voting for him on that alone. What about the others though? I don't want aMark Oaten leading our party, ready to bring shame on us at a later date.

I also want to know a bit about the wives and whether they support UKIP and if not who they do support.

progcon.org · 20-07-2006, 10:54 AM

The problem is though Matt, that you will be forcing someone (i.e. the partners) into politics and the limelight who may not have any interest in doing so.

However much we may dislike someone's sexual preferences, would you pick a faithful but ineffective leader over someone who could guarantee eu withdrawal but likes sex with giraffes?

Politicians are often accused of cynical behaviour for dragging their families out when it suits. We should be consistent and respect their choice of privacy too.

mkpdavies · 20-07-2006, 11:10 AM

If their wives say no comment, that's fine. I might actually mark them up for that.

Anthony Butcher · 20-07-2006, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by progcon.org

However much we may dislike someone's sexual preferences, would you pick a faithful but ineffective leader over someone who could guarantee eu withdrawal but likes sex with giraffes?

If I thought that a candidate was an adulterer I would never support them, regardless of how good they are or how much I liked their politics.

How can you ever trust anyone who lies to their own family and risks humiliating them through the papers. It is a sure sign of someone only out for themselves and that would not be the kind of person I want running my party.

Call it moralising if you wish, but I expect high standards from my politicians. I don't expect them to be perfect, but I do expect them to at least aspire to being a decent person.

In my opinion it is impossible to be an effective leader if you are also fundamentally selfish and dishonest.

progcon.org · 20-07-2006, 11:24 AM

That's fair enough as your view and I understand that. You want a good wholesome person no matter how ineffective.

Why does trust not matter to me? Because I don't trust politicians. Period.

It's like my career on the trading floor. Anyone who seeks to claim they are doing it for anyhting but the money is a liar. It is 100% about the money. For politicians it is about money and power.

I judge them on what they do not what they say and expect them all to be lying ********.

For example, any politician with young children who wants to be PM and claims to be a 'family man' is clearly lying. No real family man would miss so much of those early formative years to be off raising their own political profile.

They all lie. It is just that they have different stories and angles to climb that greasy ladder and being 'wholesome' is just another of those angles, usually to hide shortcomings where it usually matters; their effectiveness as a politician.

For me it is simply a question of are they forwarding the delivery of my beliefs or not?

Bluemerle · 20-07-2006, 11:46 AM

Well Richard's past is an open book. He is amicably divorced from his wife of 15 years. I believe he has a girl friend, but not a partner.

20-07-2006, 10:09 AM	#3 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,183 Party: Libertarian Party	I don't. If we had known more about Blairs money grabbing wife, then perhaps we would never have voted Blair and saved this country from his dictatorship. It's important. I know Nigel is married to a German, but likes the odd away fixture. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

20-07-2006, 10:50 AM	#5 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,183 Party: Libertarian Party	I want to know a bit about them. Doesn't mean I'm going to moralise on everything, but if one of them is like Mark Oaten, cheater, user of rent boys, likes rolling around in *****. Then I want the chance to reject them. I accept Nigel likes the odd away fixture. Not great, but wouldn't stop me voting for him on that alone. What about the others though? I don't want aMark Oaten leading our party, ready to bring shame on us at a later date. I also want to know a bit about the wives and whether they support UKIP and if not who they do support. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

20-07-2006, 11:10 AM	#7 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 31,183 Party: Libertarian Party	If their wives say no comment, that's fine. I might actually mark them up for that. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

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20-07-2006, 10:07 AM	#2 (permalink)
progcon.org Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 934	I think as we have seen from the Blairs - the less we see of partners the better. We vote for an individual not a couple.

20-07-2006, 10:35 AM	#4 (permalink)
progcon.org Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 934	But how to you square their political outlooks? What if the candidate is small government but their partner not? Husbands and wives often have very different politics. Our job is to judge the candidates on their stated agenda, not whether they are straight, gay, single, married, faithful, unfaithful. We are seeking to be a small government libertarian party, and we should avoid Tory moralising. If Richard/Nigel is secretly banging a 18 year-old boy, or whether he is a church-going man who has only ever shagged one woman, his wife, means nothing to me. I want to know if he can do the job, not who he is doing. If the Ski supporters lower this contest into moralising, low level personal attacks, it will make it difficult to heal the wounds later. We are all in the same party, don't seek to destroy any candidate as UKIP will be the loser.

20-07-2006, 10:54 AM	#6 (permalink)
progcon.org Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 934	The problem is though Matt, that you will be forcing someone (i.e. the partners) into politics and the limelight who may not have any interest in doing so. However much we may dislike someone's sexual preferences, would you pick a faithful but ineffective leader over someone who could guarantee eu withdrawal but likes sex with giraffes? Politicians are often accused of cynical behaviour for dragging their families out when it suits. We should be consistent and respect their choice of privacy too.

20-07-2006, 11:24 AM	#9 (permalink)
progcon.org Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 934	That's fair enough as your view and I understand that. You want a good wholesome person no matter how ineffective. Why does trust not matter to me? Because I don't trust politicians. Period. It's like my career on the trading floor. Anyone who seeks to claim they are doing it for anyhting but the money is a liar. It is 100% about the money. For politicians it is about money and power. I judge them on what they do not what they say and expect them all to be lying ********. For example, any politician with young children who wants to be PM and claims to be a 'family man' is clearly lying. No real family man would miss so much of those early formative years to be off raising their own political profile. They all lie. It is just that they have different stories and angles to climb that greasy ladder and being 'wholesome' is just another of those angles, usually to hide shortcomings where it usually matters; their effectiveness as a politician. For me it is simply a question of are they forwarding the delivery of my beliefs or not?

20-07-2006, 11:46 AM	#10 (permalink)
Bluemerle Uber Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Dorset. Posts: 3,252	Well Richard's past is an open book. He is amicably divorced from his wife of 15 years. I believe he has a girl friend, but not a partner.