Millennium3

[quote="kernow"][quote="Millennium3"]I did say that the policy needed to be 'proclaimed'. I am not sure that our existing policy would be effective. With effectively open borders there are many illegal immigrants here who, if caught, would not say from whence they come.

Lewkip

The simple reason why the BNP has done well and we have not is down to leadership, not the immigration issue.

I consider Nick Griffin an odious man but give him his credit: He will mix it up on the front line where it counts. I cannot remember seeing Roger Knapman or any of the NEC doing anything like that, even within UKIP communiques, let alone major media.

We have the reputation of being the anti-EU party but have failed to capture its essence and cascade it across all areas of national life: Overbearing bureaucracy, lack of accountability, the interests of others being put before our own etc. All heady themes that we could easily have used in the local elections without risking us being called racist.

I am now looking towards the upcoming leadership campaign with interest. I am not happy to learn of the move of our head office from Birmingham to Cornwall with just two paid members of staff to be supplemented by volunteers, with office hours closing at 5pm. I want a fresh dynamism. Full credit to Roger for taking us this far but the party needs to move on, and I want to see a leadership that does not dismiss the posts on a site like this but embraces them, warts and all. We are the kernel of the party, and want to see it do better.

Three years is not long until the next major elections. Let's have the changes ring in from now. I want to see a viable business plan template that shows:

1) how branches can be started from scratch, including the best ways of accessing funding using past donor case studies

2) how long it would take to leaflet a ward on foot (I have kept a diary of my travels)

3) what steps are needed to access members' address details to keep them on side

4) what UKIP-friendly celebrities would be willing to hold court at fund raising dinners

5) what steps are needed to create UKIP stalls selling our merchandise and ideas

6) simple steps on creating web site presences

7) how to use the Freedom of Information Act to prise nuggets out of local and central government

and so on and so on.

In the early hours of Friday May 5, I saw how easy it was for David Dimbleby to unravel Nick Griffin on the BBC as he was bathing in the afterglow of his success. Are we saying that we are so poor in organising ourselves that such an imbecile can pull off a set of stunning upset victories?

The shame is not on the BNP, but on us. And the sooner our senior management realise this, the better.

Millennium3

Surely the criticisms and suggestions you make for improvement are in essence failure of leadership.

I to look forward to the appointment of a new leader who will get to grips with turning UKIP into a real force. Opportunities abound!

Andy

As an ex UKIP member, the problem with UKIP may have arisen thorugh poor leadership, but now are much deeper than that. A change of leader will not be enough.

The whole perception that the average voter has of UKIP is of a one issue right wing party. The fact that the UKIP leadership were unable to embrace the anti EU feeling that was present at the last euro elections only added to the feeling that a UKIP vote is a wasted vote.

The only way any of us will get any of the policies we want is to elect MP's to parliament. We are a million miles from achieving even one MP.

The popularity of the current government is at an all time low, the issues close to our hearts on British independance, border controls, asylum and immigration, crime etc etc are all to the fore right now in the British press, so why is that the people are not voting for UKIP in droves ?

It is because UKIP is a spent force, it has failed to achieve it's purpose and this sense of failure is deep rooted in the minds of the electorate.

The only possible way forward for those of us who share the same ideals and the same vision, is for all of these silly little parties to get together in an alliance and form a brand new party , with a new name and a new image.

If the leaders of all these parties won't do it, then us ordinary people must, whether it members of UKIP, Veritas, New Party, ED's, Popular alliance, or people like me who have lost the will to join any of these. We should go beyond the leaders of all these parties and do it ourselves.

We only have 3/4 years to get organised.

girlfriday

[quote="Millennium3"][quote="kernow"]

Lewkip

Andy,

I can share your pessimism. But look at the results in my borough Lewisham: The Lib-Dems steamed ahead with ten new seats and the Greens picked up five new ones too. But nationally, both parties failed to replicate this upset result.

Why?

Because local action on the ground irrespective of national feeling is a decisive factor in elections. Had these parties been as hard core in all wards as they were in their target ones then the news headlines would be very different.

There are only so many resources one can use to target but is that the only way?

Why can we not take a leaf out of the franchise industry that develops territories irrespective of the demographics that we use to justify our targetting. I suggest that a random sample of 5% of any community in the UK will probably throw up the same kind of preferences and fears, regardless of location. These communities are probably more alike than we care to realise, and while there are specific causes and concerns, they can essentially be boiled down to issues of neglect that is common to all.

It seems to me that our response ought to be based on tackling causes of concern as a business need: Identifying, reporting, following up and communicating on issues rather than dwelling on the concerns itself. And just like any franchisee's obligation to keep the shine on the franchisor's name plate, there ought to be systematic and continuous marketing and promotion of the business.

No, I think there is a lot we can still do, without a name change, without merging with other parties. There are countless stories on companies being brought back from the brink of disaster and UKIP is not unusual in this regard. And yes I appreciate UKIP is not a commercial entity but much like a company, we will thrive or die by how relevant we are to the public.

It's not all lost.

Resigned Member

And while u are arguing whether or not UKIP needs to toughen up its immigration policy, Croucher is passing details of UKIP members to the communists at Searchlight and the SWP at Workers against racism and Nigel Farage ,the supposed right wing Conservative who is Crouchers boss,approves of this.

Andy

I absolutely agree with that statement, but it depends on the product you are trying to sell.

UKIP is not a sellable product anymore. It missed it's chance in 2004.
In a general election Europe is way down the list of priorities and when you say UKIP everyone immediately thinks Europe, not crime, not health, not education..........therin lies the problem. I don't believe you will ever change that , certainly not for the next few general elections and by then it will be too late.

Lewkip

The situation in Europe or rather the EU (as I think the tag Euroscepticism is inaccurate but I digress), will worsen over time as it did in the old USSR. It is only a matter of time, and is UKIP's long-term golden trump card.

But we need to show we are a party of note inspite of the EU for two reasons: 1) To dispel the one-policy pony opinion 2) What we would do if we were in power, preferably without any reference to any EU savings as it would put us on par with the other parties - again, our reputation is forged forever as the anti-EU party so we can wear it lightly in other policy areas to our credit.

These last elections have shown me personally the power of local relevancy - the Lib-Dems triumphs in Lewisham are there for anyone to witness. Ignore these lessons at our peril. But if we learn, and learn well, we can triumph.

Fancy a quick lesson in overcoming failure? How about the Japanese Trafalgar 100 years ago when the lessons of a heavy defeat by the Russians a few years before, set powerful new forces in motion. And the Brits had a thing or two to do with it:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asi...ic/4448195.stm

It's been done before and can be done again.

gimlet

Resigned member

You said:

And while u are arguing whether or not UKIP needs to toughen up its immigration policy, Croucher is passing details of UKIP members to the communists at Searchlight and the SWP at Workers against racism and Nigel Farage ,the supposed right wing Conservative who is Crouchers boss,approves of this.

Please post or PM your evidence that this is happening.

Regards

John