One Londoner

If, as Bellatrix says elsewhere on the forum, http://www.ukipforum.co.uk/about6832-15.html

is UKIP really a fully-fledged party or single-issue, like the Referendum Party in 1997, which said it would disband as soon as it achieved its aim of a fair referendum on our EU membership?

Are UKIP's candidates under a misapprehension when they spend their time and money standing in parliamentary and local elections if the leadership actually wants someone else to run the country?

C_steam

which do you think?

mfaithfull

The answer is simple. UKIP want British people chosen by the British people to run Britain.
Most people wrongly believe that this is the current situation. Actually most of our laws are written by committees of Eurocrats who are 90%+ not elected by anyone in this country and will never have to live under the crazy laws they dream up.
If no other major party will stand up for democracy then we are the only legitimate source of political representation and we have a responsibility to govern the country.
Anyone who isn't prepared to take responsibility shouldn't stand for office and anyone who does not believe in democracy (or who's party is against it LIB\LAB\CON\SNP\PC) has no right to stand.
As a BBC camera woman said to me (off camera) on election night 2005.
Most people would choose your policies, by rights you should be the MP.

Anthony Butcher

UKIP has a mix, as you well know, of people who want a pressure group and others who want a proper party.

C_steam

Yes, but I was interested in finding out what a relative newcomer to the forum perceived. But now you've given the answer away......

:wink:

mfaithfull

Sorry to ruin your suspense Steamy, I'm a bit hyper having just persuaded a focus group to vote against regionalisation of the police force but that is way off topic

Anthony, if more than 50% of people want a government with UKIP policies, as the polls repeatedly suggest and 350+ UKIP members were prepared to risk being elected less than a year ago, backed by thousands more who campaigned, then who is it exactly who still wants UKIP to be a pressure group rather than forming a government :?:
I acknowledge that there are many who think this is an unrealistic choice and want to limit their ambitions to something they see as achievable, but do they really want to limit the ambitions of the party?

In the end the question you have to ask is exactly what good is a pressure group in an EU super state?

I'm fully prepared to acknowledge that we are not a party ready to run the country but that doesn't make any government formed by other the parties any more legitimate. They lost their right to power when they voted for unconstitutional, illegal and treasonous treaty ratifications. They confirm their illegitimacy every time they pass an EU law.

We will govern in the end because we must even if reluctantly. It's our country and we will not let it slip away.

Swivel Eyed Fanatic

Well that will be a phyric victory since we are going to get super size regional police forces whether we want them or not. New Labour Policy is to modernise what they don't already control and regionalisation is their preferred route under a smoke screen of making things more accountable to local people by devolving control from Westminster to the Regions. It's all a typical New Labour Con since control will actually be even more centralised under a regional structure. The legacy of David Blunket will be a single UK wide Policy force controlled directly from the Home office, no more individual Chief Constables with their potentially troublesome ideas about Home Secretaries not being above the law!

Mean while however, the regionalisation of the Fire Service continues almost unopposed and with very little publicity. The North East Regional Fire authority is already in place and making plans for the future. How accountable to the people of Durham for example will the North East Regional Fire Authority actually be when their local Council has just one single seat on an Authority covering from the Tees to the Scottish Boarders?

Buffin

Suppose for a moment UKIP wants to be a pressure group rather than a party.

UKIP can only be an effective pressure group if the big parties are worried about losing votes to it.

What will worry them most is that the relatively young fourth party may continue to attract more votes - fear of the unknown.

So UKIP has to put itself forward as a party - even if it just wants to be an effective pressure group.

spaman

A very interesting question, and one that deserves a full answer.....

I can only put my viewpoint as one fairly new to UKIP, but this is how I see it all:
UKIP were formed to resolve one major problem - something dear to all of our hearts..... getting out of the clutches of an arrogant unelected over-powering and corrupt institution.......

The crucial thing here, and answered elsewhere, is that should/when we achieve seperation from the EU, the reason for being does tend to be less all consuming, and well maybe that would be a good time to call it a day and rely on others to take things forward....

However, its not that easy to just throw in the batton, there are so many other things that are developing as UKIP policy, and a party with common sense needs to be there to take these forward...

So, I think UKIP has become a very real political party - with real goals and objectives, and while the EU is still the main target, it is only a symptom of what is wrong with the UK, and the rest of the world, and once in parliament, UKIP would go on to bring sense to so many other things....... so, yes, the scope has become larger, but this won't be visible to many until we reach that crucial point of a majority in Westminster...

Why would we want another party to run the country when they have all capitulated to the EU - we can't trust them on that, how can we trust them to do the right thing after that....

UKIP may have started with one policy, but it sure as heck encompasses a lot more than the EU for me....... and no, it would be impossible to stop and allow others to carry on - UKIP is here to stay.
It has to be.

Bellatrix

I'm very happy for UKIP to run the country, I just don't want to do it myself longterm.

Ideally, I am pro anarchy. Not the burning things and throwing bricks at McDonalds, but the utopia where we never need a government.

So long as we are out of the EU and being run by a liberal pro-low tax and small government party I think I will be fairly contented. My main bone of contention which means I can't just relax and get on with my life is the EU.

And by the way - that was my personal view. Not the view of anyone else.
You ca't get rich working for someone else, unless you are Blunkett. And I want a big house and a pony.