Membership renewal

Nick Moody · 07-03-2005, 04:47 PM

I have just had my membership renewal sent to me. At the end of it it describes the EU as the 'Evil Union'. I don't think that it is very sensible to so describe the EU. For one thing it patently isn't 'evil'. It is wrong, undemocratic, overly bureaucratic, intent on destroying the nation state, corrupt and many other things but not evil. Hitler was evil, so was Stalin and Pol Pot. The EU is not like those dictators. It is very reminiscent of Ronald Reagan describing the USSR as the evil empire and I can remember nearly everybody ridiculing that. It will do our cause no good by making such comments.
I am renewing my membership by the way.

UKIP MAN · 07-03-2005, 04:57 PM

Evil n. 1 a force or power that brings about wickedness and harm.

Evil a. 2 A wicked or morally wrong act or thing.

Evil. very unpleasant

Sounds like the EU to me :?

mkpdavies · 07-03-2005, 04:58 PM

I thought that too when my wifes membership renewal came through! It is overly harsh and I hope they remove it. Perhaps he was trying to scare the wobblers?

My wife has only been a member for 3 months, so it was a bit odd that they sent a renewal anyway!

B.A.Ware · 07-03-2005, 07:47 PM

Typical head office efficiency.

Paul Birch · 08-03-2005, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Moody

I have just had my membership renewal sent to me. At the end of it it describes the EU as the 'Evil Union'. I don't think that it is very sensible to so describe the EU. For one thing it patently isn't 'evil'. It is wrong, undemocratic, overly bureaucratic, intent on destroying the nation state, corrupt and many other things but not evil. Hitler was evil, so was Stalin and Pol Pot. The EU is not like those dictators. It is very reminiscent of Ronald Reagan describing the USSR as the evil empire and I can remember nearly everybody ridiculing that. It will do our cause no good by making such comments.

Ronald Reagan was right. The USSR was an evil empire. UKIP is right. The EU is an evil union. It would be naive in the extreme to deny that the EU has the potential to become an even more horrendously totalitarian monster than the USSR. Whereas in the early days Nazi Germany was not violent or openly evil - merely more and more oppressive - just like the EU!

Anthony Butcher · 08-03-2005, 12:20 AM

The problem is that it is just silly, and it looks amateurish; both of which UKIP's image can do without.

Paul Birch · 08-03-2005, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony Butcher

The problem is that it is just silly, and it looks amateurish; both of which UKIP's image can do without.

I can see what you mean. But look at it this way. Do you agree that the EU is evil? If not, why on earth are we bothering with all this thankless struggle? Just for a measly few billions a year? Surely it's the theft of our vital freedoms that matters - and that's definitely what I'd call evil. And if it is evil, shouldn't we be saying so? What if we are ridiculed? They ridiculed Reagan - but he won!

Anthony Butcher · 08-03-2005, 12:34 AM

I wouldn't choose evil as a phrase to use, unless I was jokingly referring to it as the Evil Empire (also used for Microsoft of course). Misguided, corrupt, undemocratic, yes, evil... no.

Evil suggests an intended malice to me, which I don't think is there. Hubris certainly, greed yes, incompetence yes, corruption yes, malice no.

Exorcist · 08-03-2005, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony Butcher

I wouldn't choose evil as a phrase to use, unless I was jokingly referring to it as the Evil Empire (also used for Microsoft of course). Misguided, corrupt, undemocratic, yes, evil... no.

Evil suggests an intended malice to me, which I don't think is there. Hubris certainly, greed yes, incompetence yes, corruption yes, malice no.

The EU has almost completed the task of depriving your country of it's right to self government against the wishes of it's people and you say that is not evil? Who are the incompetent ones? The EU? For an organisation you deem incompetent they seem to be having an enormous amount of success!

Lawrie Boxall · 08-03-2005, 08:02 AM

Am I alone in thinking that it's a bit rich of the Americans and British to declare Syria a pariah state when these countries mounted an invasion of another country thousands of miles from their borders. My press release would ask, "why is Tony Blair still in power after lying to parliament and people and taking us to war on a false premise"

07-03-2005, 04:47 PM	#1 (permalink)
Nick Moody Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: North Yorkshire Posts: 100	Membership renewal I have just had my membership renewal sent to me. At the end of it it describes the EU as the 'Evil Union'. I don't think that it is very sensible to so describe the EU. For one thing it patently isn't 'evil'. It is wrong, undemocratic, overly bureaucratic, intent on destroying the nation state, corrupt and many other things but not evil. Hitler was evil, so was Stalin and Pol Pot. The EU is not like those dictators. It is very reminiscent of Ronald Reagan describing the USSR as the evil empire and I can remember nearly everybody ridiculing that. It will do our cause no good by making such comments. I am renewing my membership by the way.

07-03-2005, 04:58 PM	#3 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,849 Party: Libertarian Party	I thought that too when my wifes membership renewal came through! It is overly harsh and I hope they remove it. Perhaps he was trying to scare the wobblers? My wife has only been a member for 3 months, so it was a bit odd that they sent a renewal anyway! __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

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07-03-2005, 04:57 PM	#2 (permalink)
UKIP MAN Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,898	Evil n. 1 a force or power that brings about wickedness and harm. Evil a. 2 A wicked or morally wrong act or thing. Evil. very unpleasant Sounds like the EU to me :?

07-03-2005, 07:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
B.A.Ware Moderator Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Birmingham Posts: 4,506 Party: UKIP	Typical head office efficiency.

08-03-2005, 12:20 AM	#6 (permalink)
Anthony Butcher Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Long Ashton, Bristol Posts: 10,152 Party: None	The problem is that it is just silly, and it looks amateurish; both of which UKIP's image can do without.

08-03-2005, 12:34 AM	#8 (permalink)
Anthony Butcher Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Long Ashton, Bristol Posts: 10,152 Party: None	I wouldn't choose evil as a phrase to use, unless I was jokingly referring to it as the Evil Empire (also used for Microsoft of course). Misguided, corrupt, undemocratic, yes, evil... no. Evil suggests an intended malice to me, which I don't think is there. Hubris certainly, greed yes, incompetence yes, corruption yes, malice no.

08-03-2005, 08:02 AM	#10 (permalink)
Lawrie Boxall Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Sandhurst Posts: 1,015	Am I alone in thinking that it's a bit rich of the Americans and British to declare Syria a pariah state when these countries mounted an invasion of another country thousands of miles from their borders. My press release would ask, "why is Tony Blair still in power after lying to parliament and people and taking us to war on a false premise"