Rubbish results again

mkpdavies · 04-03-2005, 02:02 PM

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=4208338

Quote:

RESULTS:

Conwy County Borough – Llandrillo yn Rhos: C 720, Plaid Cymru 351, Lib Dem 317, Lab 175, Ind 169, 152, 131. (May 2003 – Three seats C 1110, Ind 989, 960, 882, C 834, 724, Lib Dem 770, Lab 497, Plaid Cymru 386). C gain from Ind. Swing 1.9% Plaid Cymru to C.

Luton Borough – Lewsey: Lab 778, Lib Dem 349, C 244, UKIP 98, Green 29. (May 2003 – Three seats Lab 1029, 999, 936, C 470, 436, 424, Lib Dem 382, 333, 327). Lab hold. Swing 3.7% Lab to Lib Dem.

Newark and Sherwood District – Southwell East: Lib Dem 376, C 338. (May 2003 – Lib Dem 489, C 307). Lib Dem hold. Swing 8.7% Lib Dem to C.

Solihull Borough – St Alphege: C 1760, Lib Dem 1673, Lab 133. (June 2004 – Three seats C 2849, 2799, 2664, Lib Dem 1203, 1023, 980, Lab 422). C hold. Swing 18.6% C to Lib Dem.

Stoke-on-Trent City – East Valley: Lib Dem 525, Lab 496, BNP 464, Ind 445, C 150. (June 2004 – Lab 823, BNP 674, Ind 429, C 406, Lib Dem 330). Lib Dem hold. Swing 9.9% Lab to Lib Dem.

Wear Valley District – Bishop Auckland Town: Lib Dem 181, Lab 161, C 135, UKIP 16. (May 2003 – Two seats Lab 425, Ind 421, Lab 389, Lib Dem 284, 279). Lib Dem gain from Ind. Swing 7.6% Lab to Lib Dem.

Sorry but I am not taking any heart from these results. Not standing in a lot of places and rubbish results where we do. Not good enough.

Stoke-on-trent are on the verge of going BNP, and have been threatening to for some time.

B.A.Ware · 04-03-2005, 04:01 PM

Very depressing, why are ukip not active in Stoke there seem to be a lot of disenfranchised voters who have nowhere to turn but the BNP.

mkpdavies · 04-03-2005, 04:13 PM

My thoughts exactly. UKIP might not go there, but I know a party who will!

Tom Wilde · 04-03-2005, 04:45 PM

The trouble is partly that a lot of people in UKIP don't take local elections seriously. If we want win them, then we have to stand and we have to campaign hard. Lots of folk think it isn't worth the effort because only MPs can get us out of the EU, not local councillors. They don't seem to see that in this country winning local council elections is the route to building local credibility and thus winning MPs.

Having said which, if people stand in local elections solely because they want to improve the party's chances in general elections, then they will get humiliatingly defeated. I once went to a local hustings where a UKIP local council candidate said he was just standing to raise UKIP's profile so that we might vote for it in the general election. People were most displeased - they had local issues they wanted addressed, involving traffic management mainly. On polling day the UKIP guy came last with a derisory vote.

So if we want to do well in local elections, we have to really care about local issues. If you don't care about local issues, don't stand - concentrate on the national camapign. But if you do genuinely care about improving life in your town, then for pity's sake stand for the local council on a UKIP ticket, get elected and do a good job for your community. It isn't glamorous, but you'll also be doing more than most to ensure UKIP candidates make it to Westminster.

Percy the Poodle · 06-03-2005, 07:13 PM

Exactly, Tom. To win council seats you have to have a local manifesto and work hard in the area.

This is not as disheartening as you all think. We do not have the local political history to do pick up 'default' votes. We also (have you noticed) lack money for such projects.

Our success at local level will have to follow national success as our main aim regaining our sovereignty is purely national. When we acquire a national political image across the board, people will vote at local level.

It will take time and money :roll:

Aardvark · 06-03-2005, 09:57 PM

I sit as an Independent on my local town council. I topped the poll over 2 Tories, 1 Labour and another Independent who shared my ticket. If I had stood as UKIP I would probably have come last despite my high local profile.

UKIP is seen a national/international party. There is no coherent local government strategy which is why the results speak for themselves.

Somebody stood as UKIP in the next town. Despite my trying to persuade him to address local issues he still said in his leaflet, 'UKIP has local government policies on withdrawing from the EU'. He did work and got over 14% of the vote, but that was still fourth. Had he topped the poll he had no idea how, as one of 49 District Councillors, he could have influenced anything. He had done no work on local government, knew none of the issues locally and because he was new in the area he had no real appreciation of local geography. A lot of people saw it as a joke that one district councillor could withdraw us from the EU. He did raise the profile, but hasn't followed up and we haven't got a UKIP candidate for the general election.

Building from the base up is what worked for the Lib/Dems who have a creditable record on 'pavement politics' - getting little things done like having paving slabs replaced that no-one else can be bothered with. My experience of UKIP activists suggests that they see the big picture, but don't thing in terms of the little things.

Sarumano · 07-03-2005, 12:00 AM

Hear hear.

More evidence that local politics should be divorced from national parties.

You cannot expect 'outsiders' to be foisted on to an area in the same way that a party can say 'safe seat, therefore we put X in to be returned as MP'.

On the other hand, Aardvark, since you're an independent anyway, you could change your party alliegance to UKIP... the worst they'll do is hold a by-election, no?

B.A.Ware · 07-03-2005, 12:08 AM

Aardvark you are absolutely right ukip should build from the ground upwards that is exactly what we are trying to do, even in this election are goal is to get a councillor in the next local elections. Ps why don’t you join and help promote the cause

elbarracuda · 07-03-2005, 12:17 AM

It's common sense to me. You promote local issues in local elections, national issues in national elections and european issues in european elections.
That's not to say you can't bring in European issues which impact on most things.
And B A Ware is quite right. You have to build up. Field a candidate in one ward then 2 etc. Aim to win one council seat and so on.
Build profile and local support.
Rome wasn't built in a day

Exorcist · 07-03-2005, 01:29 AM

Eureka! I've just realised where we are going wrong! Do you think we could persuade Sykes to finance a licenced UKIP club in every constituency?

04-03-2005, 04:13 PM	#3 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,849 Party: Libertarian Party	My thoughts exactly. UKIP might not go there, but I know a party who will! __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

07-03-2005, 12:17 AM	#9 (permalink)
elbarracuda Newbie Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Birmingham-Sutton Coldfield Posts: 7	Fight local issues in local elections and national issues in It's common sense to me. You promote local issues in local elections, national issues in national elections and european issues in european elections. That's not to say you can't bring in European issues which impact on most things. And B A Ware is quite right. You have to build up. Field a candidate in one ward then 2 etc. Aim to win one council seat and so on. Build profile and local support. Rome wasn't built in a day

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04-03-2005, 04:01 PM	#2 (permalink)
B.A.Ware Moderator Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Birmingham Posts: 4,506 Party: UKIP	Very depressing, why are ukip not active in Stoke there seem to be a lot of disenfranchised voters who have nowhere to turn but the BNP.

04-03-2005, 04:45 PM	#4 (permalink)
Tom Wilde Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: London. Posts: 2,891	The trouble is partly that a lot of people in UKIP don't take local elections seriously. If we want win them, then we have to stand and we have to campaign hard. Lots of folk think it isn't worth the effort because only MPs can get us out of the EU, not local councillors. They don't seem to see that in this country winning local council elections is the route to building local credibility and thus winning MPs. Having said which, if people stand in local elections solely because they want to improve the party's chances in general elections, then they will get humiliatingly defeated. I once went to a local hustings where a UKIP local council candidate said he was just standing to raise UKIP's profile so that we might vote for it in the general election. People were most displeased - they had local issues they wanted addressed, involving traffic management mainly. On polling day the UKIP guy came last with a derisory vote. So if we want to do well in local elections, we have to really care about local issues. If you don't care about local issues, don't stand - concentrate on the national camapign. But if you do genuinely care about improving life in your town, then for pity's sake stand for the local council on a UKIP ticket, get elected and do a good job for your community. It isn't glamorous, but you'll also be doing more than most to ensure UKIP candidates make it to Westminster.

06-03-2005, 07:13 PM	#5 (permalink)
Percy the Poodle Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: East Devon Posts: 362	Exactly, Tom. To win council seats you have to have a local manifesto and work hard in the area. This is not as disheartening as you all think. We do not have the local political history to do pick up 'default' votes. We also (have you noticed) lack money for such projects. Our success at local level will have to follow national success as our main aim regaining our sovereignty is purely national. When we acquire a national political image across the board, people will vote at local level. It will take time and money :roll:

06-03-2005, 09:57 PM	#6 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,928	I sit as an Independent on my local town council. I topped the poll over 2 Tories, 1 Labour and another Independent who shared my ticket. If I had stood as UKIP I would probably have come last despite my high local profile. UKIP is seen a national/international party. There is no coherent local government strategy which is why the results speak for themselves. Somebody stood as UKIP in the next town. Despite my trying to persuade him to address local issues he still said in his leaflet, 'UKIP has local government policies on withdrawing from the EU'. He did work and got over 14% of the vote, but that was still fourth. Had he topped the poll he had no idea how, as one of 49 District Councillors, he could have influenced anything. He had done no work on local government, knew none of the issues locally and because he was new in the area he had no real appreciation of local geography. A lot of people saw it as a joke that one district councillor could withdraw us from the EU. He did raise the profile, but hasn't followed up and we haven't got a UKIP candidate for the general election. Building from the base up is what worked for the Lib/Dems who have a creditable record on 'pavement politics' - getting little things done like having paving slabs replaced that no-one else can be bothered with. My experience of UKIP activists suggests that they see the big picture, but don't thing in terms of the little things.

07-03-2005, 12:00 AM	#7 (permalink)
Sarumano Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Salisbury Posts: 309	Hear hear. More evidence that local politics should be divorced from national parties. You cannot expect 'outsiders' to be foisted on to an area in the same way that a party can say 'safe seat, therefore we put X in to be returned as MP'. On the other hand, Aardvark, since you're an independent anyway, you could change your party alliegance to UKIP... the worst they'll do is hold a by-election, no?

07-03-2005, 12:08 AM	#8 (permalink)
B.A.Ware Moderator Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Birmingham Posts: 4,506 Party: UKIP	Aardvark you are absolutely right ukip should build from the ground upwards that is exactly what we are trying to do, even in this election are goal is to get a councillor in the next local elections. Ps why don’t you join and help promote the cause

07-03-2005, 01:29 AM	#10 (permalink)
Exorcist Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 91	Eureka! I've just realised where we are going wrong! Do you think we could persuade Sykes to finance a licenced UKIP club in every constituency?