C_steam

This is a powerful forum. Besides opinion and debate, a great deal of referenced news articles, extracts from legislation and quotes (verified) from Politicians has been published.

For PPC's and active members, rather than them having to data-mine themselves, would it be possible through this forum to set up a number of 'Information sheets'?

My image is a post with the information sheet title - the first post would be the draft version of the sheet by whoever wanted to post. I suggest this would be in the format of TITLE (i.e the issue), UKIP POSITION, PROBLEM (explain why and how, in brief, this issue affects the UK) and REFERENCE - where we place the supporting referenced data, quotes and so on.

These posts would be up for critical review, original poster to amend the first post in the light of reasonable comment and addition. In this way we could build a really useful resource.

On the other hand it could be a really **** idea. What do you all think?Comment please.

mkpdavies

A good idea, I learn more from this site than any other. A one-stop shop if you will.

Obviously you have some rubbish to wade through too, so it is all about putting in the effort to do this.

I have printed many of the articles on this site, ready for any campaign I may fight. Maybe people can pick and choose what they want from here anyway?

I don't know if Anthony has any tools that might make the process easier to create a UKIP dossier (labout have tainted that word haven't they!), as it would certainly be a useful document to be able to quote from etc.

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Anthony Butcher

It is something that I have been looking at for some time. The problem is collating all of the information and finding the necessary facts and figures. It is much harder that it may appear at first.

For instance, just finding out how much money Britain pays to the EU overall reveals many different numbers. How do we really know which one is correct? The only option is to go back to the original source.... which is what? Finding out where to look, what needs to be included and left out and so on is more of a job than I can handle at the moment.

UKIP has, in the past, had a research team, who would be perfect for this kind of work. Perhaps our EU researchers could be put to good use creating this information?

Dave

Extremely good idea, seeing as we get little from HQ (not a dig but an unfortunate fact), and not wanting to be a fly in the oinment there are a couple of probs.

1. Can this forum allow for a private area
2. as this is an open forum how do we know that genuine UKIP people are not being thrown a curve ball
3. NO hiding behind pseudonyms, full disclosure of Name and Branch details, maybe even membership number.

Even if it was just used for validated quotes, it would be useful, but I like the idea of fact sheet, keypoint sheet whatever you want to call it, privacy is the key to this one though.

Dave

C_steam

Good point Dave. Anthony - how to progress technically? any ideas?

Incidentally my experience on this sort of thing is to get started, rather than worry whether the content is possible. Once started, the content can come in time.

Dave

If we are going to do this lets do it, bullet points can be taken from below, or it can be played with by others to create something shorter and punchier, I have no problem this being in the public domain but other policy areas should be just for the UKIP members.


The European Union

Consists of six political institutions :-
The Presidency (rotates between counties, six monthly)
The European Council (meetings of Heads of States/Government in secret & never published). Function :- to establish policy guidelines for European Integration.
Council of Ministers (meeting of Ministerial representatives, ie all Foreign Ministers etc.)
The President (Romano Prodi/Jose Durno Barroso, we have no say in this appointment.
The Commission (Commissioners appointed for 5 years by Heads of State/Government, they are there to further the EU. Not represent their countries).
The EU Parliament (it is not a parliamentary democracy, it elects No Government governmental functions are carried By the Council & the Commission).
In 1975 the British people were misled INTO phpbb_thinking they were voting at the referendum for a Common Market, A trading partnership, 47% on the Electorate voted, 60% voted Yes 30% No.

The destruction of our democracy by all our mainstream politicians
This is what they have signed us up to :-

The EU Commission receives from every country
Agricultural levy on trade with non-member countries.
Common External Tariff (CET) duties.
1.4% of each countries' VAT.
Contribution of each countries GNP.
This costs the UK £30 million/day INTO phpbb_the EU Commission (Brussels) coffers.

For every £2 we give the EU;
Brussels gives 90p to other countries. £13.5M/day
Brussels returns 70p to the UK in grants with conditions £10.5M/day
EU running costs 20p £3M/day
Brussels needs 20p to cover fraud & corruption £3M/day
The EU provides a blanket, life-time immunity to all officials and servants of the Institutions :- "In the territory of each member state and whatever their nationality, officials and other servants of the Communities shall be immune from legal proceedings in respect of acts performed by them in their official capacity, including their words (spoken or written). They shall continue to enjoy this immunity after they have ceased in office." The Fraud Squad is not allowed to enter their buildings.

The auditors have been unable to sign the accounts off since 1994.

Brussels has a secret police force, which can arrest anyone in the UK without a warrant. They will be thrown INTO phpbb_an European jail, eventually appearing before a judge (Greek or Italian) guilty. Federal Police (Europol), Federal Prosecutor (Eurojust) Federal/Eurocrimes all operating under Corpus Juris.
Habeas Corpus :- a person presumed innocent until proved guilty & trial by jury.

How many people did you vote INTO phpbb_the Brussels Commission? Answer :- No One.

The EU parliament is a sham with no authority which is there to fool you that we are in a democracy.

The Brussels Commission produces all EU laws, 80% of laws coming out of Westminster are EU laws, they have issued over 200,000 laws over which our elected MPs have No control. Westminster is just a rubber stamp. This is Dictatorship.

New Constitution :- 350 pages (the Prime Minister said it was a tidying up operation)
The EU becomes a legally binding Federal State (a single European State), firstly, its constitutional implications are profound; secondly, there are major institutional changes; thirdly, the treaty represents an unprecedented transfer of power (unlimited) from member states to the EU. With the UK relegated to a province, England sliced INTO phpbb_EU regions, Scotland an EU region, there will be 100s of regions all reporting to the EU Commission & Not elected Parliaments. (Regional government was common in many European Countries, already representatives from Scotland, funded by the EU, attend the Committee of Regions and directly bypass Westminster).
All EU laws take complete precedence over our laws. The judges in the European court can over rule all our laws.
All member States and their constitutions would be subordinate to the EU and the European Constitution. Member States would cease being fully independent and Sovereign countries.
The Euro becomes automatic. The Central Bank issuing a "one size fits" all interest rate & member States hand over control of their economy to the EU.
The EU negotiates for all countries with the World Trade Organisation.
Our oil (like the seas) belongs to the EU. (they have temporarily postponed this).
Banning off complimentary medicines.
Banning of Political Parties opposed to the EU, the European Court of Justice ruled that the EU can lawfully suppress political criticism of its institutions and of its leading figures.
All power handed to the EU cannot be returned.
Our Constitution :- Our elected MPs form a government, which can subsequently be voted out. All laws passed are not binding on future governments.

The UK Trade, the 4th biggest economy in the world.
80% of GNP is internal trade.
11% of GNP is export, in surplus, around the world.
9% of GNP is export, in deficit, to the EU countries.
What has the EU done :-
Destroyed 1000s of Fishing Jobs. As a result houses boarded up, factories idle or demolished, rampant poverty & crime escalating.
Destroyed our seas The seas are an environmental shambles.
Brought Farming to its knees The CAP consumes 47% of the EU budget, a very wasteful & expensive mess. 90% of the laws effecting farming come from the EU.
Cost us Billions of £s. There is a time bomb in the EU, the under funded pensions.
The autumn of 2000 petrol strike, Blair & Brown stood firm & refused to lower the tax! Yes, because they were Ordered by the EU not to lower the tax! Harmonisation of taxes.

We want peace with our neighbouring European Countries, a genuine Common Market & to be self governing.
This can be done by Westminster repealing the 1972 Accession Act.

C_steam

Probably we need to seperate out the facts from the emotive words.

i.e In 1975 the British people were misled INTO phpbb_thinking they were voting at the referendum for a Common Market, A trading partnership, 47% on the Electorate voted, 60% voted Yes 30% No.

should become:-In 1975 the British people voted at the referendum for a Common Market, a trading partnership. 47% on the Electorate voted, 60% voted Yes 30% No.

Carl Faulkner

Good post Dave. Its those facts and figures that anybody advocating withdrawal from the EU should know off the top of their head...

Emotive words C_steam? Not emotive enough. The wording should be "the British people were LIED to by the politicians of the day..."

C_steam

Sorry - i know that! and agree the sentiment but.

For the purposes of an information sheet, the information should be cold and factual - is information, not opinion.

Carl Faulkner

I see your point. Not to try and cajole, just to put the facts before people. It makes sense.