English Parliament

tyke · 02-12-2004, 02:45 AM

I want to see an English Parliament with English MPs voting on English issues.

Its nothing more than the Scottish have. The Welsh have their Assembly, too, which means they are devolved from the British Parliament as well. Only England remains under the thumb of foreigners

I want all English discrimination to be stopped henceforth; I want Tony Blair to be sent back to Scotland asap and I want all of this government's anti-English policies to be stopped immediately

But most of all, I want my children to grow up in a country which is recognised as England and their nationality to be acknowledged as English.

------------------------------------

“…there is no such nationality as English” - John “Two Jags” Prescott, The Deputy Prime Minister, who is Welsh

Anthony Butcher · 02-12-2004, 03:47 AM

Welcome to the forum Tyke

Given that Blair hasn't lived in Scotland since 1972 and Prescott hasn't lived in Wales since 1953 (I believe), I don't think that either country would be happy with them being described as Scottish or Welsh. And they certainly don't have the accents that you might expect

One of the great strengths of Britain is that it is irrelevant which country we come from, and the labels of English or Welsh mean very little. I am both British and English and wouldn't have it any other way. However, we need to be careful about too much nationalism in any of the countries because it will damage the alliance. In other words, we should be happy in our differences, but not let it divide us.

Having said that, I think that we do need to strive for an equilibrium that currently is missing in this country (Britain). The first issue to address, is an English assembly. We are the ignored majority, quite probably because we aren't a minority interest group. I find it disturbing that Labour will fight for the soulless regional assemblies that very few people want, but will not even suggest an English assembly. I submitted a proposition for the UKIP manifesto on this point.

We could also see a suggesiton in our manifesto for the establishment of separate national anthems, if another proposal of mine is adopted:
http://www.ukipforum.co.uk/about23.html

tyke · 03-12-2004, 12:43 AM

I'm afraid it too late in the day to be against the break up of the UK politcally.

The Scottish have started it and the horse is out of the stables, with no chance of putting it back.

No to an Assembly. Why should we not have a Parliament of our own? Its good enough for Scotland and it is good enough for us. Would you advocate their Parliament being reduced to an Assembly in the cause of equality? And the Welsh should get their own Parliament, too.

Blair's stance on the English governing themselves is "England is too big."

Well you can drive from one end of England to the other in a day. Typical man, overstating size to suit his own ends (no pun intended)

And lets not forget the reason he allowed a Scottish Parliament - "The Scouts are a proud and historic nation." Well, so is England and all we ask for is equal treatment.

As for Blair and Prescott's nationality - they were born and raised there and would be quite shocked to discover they were being denied their right to be called Welsh or Scottish. I was born in England, but if I moved to any other country I would not simply stop being English. They moved here because they were hungry for power, not because they consider themselves English.

Besides, Prescott has said - "There is no such nationality as English." So that's the official answer, direct from the horses mouth.

I voted for you in the European elections, but at the moment, the only party representing equality for England is the EDP.

I watch with anticipation

tyke · 03-12-2004, 12:49 AM

That should read Scots, not Scouts, although they are a fine group - dib, dib, dib

ops:

mkpdavies · 03-12-2004, 10:53 AM

I've said it once, I'll say it again. If the UK is not saved from the EU first, then there won't be an England to save. We have one bullet left, shoot the bear not the wasp!

tyke · 03-12-2004, 07:20 PM

A political party is capable of having more than one item on its manifesto.

It it isn't, then it would be a disatrous mistake to vote for it.

tyke · 05-12-2004, 02:38 PM

I'm just guessing, but from the lack of commitment to a yes or no answer, then it must be in the negative

I for one cannot understand why it is not acceptable for England to be given equal treatment to Scotland?

You realise Berwick is considering going over to Scotland because of the lucrative Barnett Formula, which gives Scotland at least £1,000 per head of population more than England? Not to mention they have free home care, free residential care, free central heating and half price travel for their elderly? Kennedy also wants them to get free eye tests and dental care (for evidence of this, read his party speeches). Oh, and the Scottish MPs also voted for top up fees ONLY for England (Looks like the Welsh Assembly will reject it) - whilst rejecting it for Scotland.

That says it all, really. England gets the pooey end of the stick again. It doesn't take a half witted moron to figure out that as time passes and the gap widens, the residents of England will have the highest death rates due to quality of life and the lowest standards of healthcare!

This is a major concern for many voters and UKIP should come out and say where they stand on the matter.

Sitting on the fence is not an option. For now, the response appears to be a resounding NO to England - continue to suffer dominance and lump it

Julian Morrison · 05-12-2004, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyke

I for one cannot understand why it is not acceptable for England to be given equal treatment to Scotland?

Because we're bright enough to realise (with help from Scotland's example) that making government accountable by adding politicians is like damping a fire by spraying on liquid oxygen.

Besides, England has a historical tradition of devolved government that used to work well: the county/borough council system. Successive governments have centralized their authority, forced their funding decisions, and turned them INTO phpbb_little more than a punching-bag for unpopular tax increases. If they were restored to full function, there would be no need for an English parliament.

mkpdavies · 05-12-2004, 05:02 PM

I fully agree with Julian on this one. I also believe it is right in line with UKIP thinking.

Julian Morrison · 05-12-2004, 05:12 PM

Also councils provide the perfect size for federalizing and decentralizing national government functions, much as (was originally intended for) the federal USA.

Example: I proposed the nationwide abolition (local-charity-ization) of the NHS in another post, but another approach to the problem would be to factor it (and the corresponding school and welfare and etc) systems down to council level. So you get the "Kent health service", the "Yorkshire health service", and so forth.

02-12-2004, 02:45 AM	#11 (permalink)
tyke Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 240	English and proud of it I want to see an English Parliament with English MPs voting on English issues. Its nothing more than the Scottish have. The Welsh have their Assembly, too, which means they are devolved from the British Parliament as well. Only England remains under the thumb of foreigners I want all English discrimination to be stopped henceforth; I want Tony Blair to be sent back to Scotland asap and I want all of this government's anti-English policies to be stopped immediately But most of all, I want my children to grow up in a country which is recognised as England and their nationality to be acknowledged as English. ------------------------------------ “…there is no such nationality as English” - John “Two Jags” Prescott, The Deputy Prime Minister, who is Welsh

03-12-2004, 12:43 AM	#13 (permalink)
tyke Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 240	English Parliament I'm afraid it too late in the day to be against the break up of the UK politcally. The Scottish have started it and the horse is out of the stables, with no chance of putting it back. No to an Assembly. Why should we not have a Parliament of our own? Its good enough for Scotland and it is good enough for us. Would you advocate their Parliament being reduced to an Assembly in the cause of equality? And the Welsh should get their own Parliament, too. Blair's stance on the English governing themselves is "England is too big." Well you can drive from one end of England to the other in a day. Typical man, overstating size to suit his own ends (no pun intended) And lets not forget the reason he allowed a Scottish Parliament - "The Scouts are a proud and historic nation." Well, so is England and all we ask for is equal treatment. As for Blair and Prescott's nationality - they were born and raised there and would be quite shocked to discover they were being denied their right to be called Welsh or Scottish. I was born in England, but if I moved to any other country I would not simply stop being English. They moved here because they were hungry for power, not because they consider themselves English. Besides, Prescott has said - "There is no such nationality as English." So that's the official answer, direct from the horses mouth. I voted for you in the European elections, but at the moment, the only party representing equality for England is the EDP. I watch with anticipation

03-12-2004, 10:53 AM	#15 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,604	I've said it once, I'll say it again. If the UK is not saved from the EU first, then there won't be an England to save. We have one bullet left, shoot the bear not the wasp! __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

05-12-2004, 05:02 PM	#19 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,604	I fully agree with Julian on this one. I also believe it is right in line with UKIP thinking. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

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02-12-2004, 03:47 AM	#12 (permalink)
Anthony Butcher Administrator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Long Ashton, Bristol Posts: 9,824 Party: None	Welcome to the forum Tyke Given that Blair hasn't lived in Scotland since 1972 and Prescott hasn't lived in Wales since 1953 (I believe), I don't think that either country would be happy with them being described as Scottish or Welsh. And they certainly don't have the accents that you might expect One of the great strengths of Britain is that it is irrelevant which country we come from, and the labels of English or Welsh mean very little. I am both British and English and wouldn't have it any other way. However, we need to be careful about too much nationalism in any of the countries because it will damage the alliance. In other words, we should be happy in our differences, but not let it divide us. Having said that, I think that we do need to strive for an equilibrium that currently is missing in this country (Britain). The first issue to address, is an English assembly. We are the ignored majority, quite probably because we aren't a minority interest group. I find it disturbing that Labour will fight for the soulless regional assemblies that very few people want, but will not even suggest an English assembly. I submitted a proposition for the UKIP manifesto on this point. We could also see a suggesiton in our manifesto for the establishment of separate national anthems, if another proposal of mine is adopted: http://www.ukipforum.co.uk/about23.html

03-12-2004, 12:49 AM	#14 (permalink)
tyke Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 240	That should read Scots, not Scouts, although they are a fine group - dib, dib, dib ops:

03-12-2004, 07:20 PM	#16 (permalink)
tyke Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 240	A political party is capable of having more than one item on its manifesto. It it isn't, then it would be a disatrous mistake to vote for it.

05-12-2004, 02:38 PM	#17 (permalink)
tyke Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Yorkshire Posts: 240	I'm just guessing, but from the lack of commitment to a yes or no answer, then it must be in the negative I for one cannot understand why it is not acceptable for England to be given equal treatment to Scotland? You realise Berwick is considering going over to Scotland because of the lucrative Barnett Formula, which gives Scotland at least £1,000 per head of population more than England? Not to mention they have free home care, free residential care, free central heating and half price travel for their elderly? Kennedy also wants them to get free eye tests and dental care (for evidence of this, read his party speeches). Oh, and the Scottish MPs also voted for top up fees ONLY for England (Looks like the Welsh Assembly will reject it) - whilst rejecting it for Scotland. That says it all, really. England gets the pooey end of the stick again. It doesn't take a half witted moron to figure out that as time passes and the gap widens, the residents of England will have the highest death rates due to quality of life and the lowest standards of healthcare! This is a major concern for many voters and UKIP should come out and say where they stand on the matter. Sitting on the fence is not an option. For now, the response appears to be a resounding NO to England - continue to suffer dominance and lump it

05-12-2004, 05:12 PM	#20 (permalink)
Julian Morrison Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Banbury, England Posts: 198	Also councils provide the perfect size for federalizing and decentralizing national government functions, much as (was originally intended for) the federal USA. Example: I proposed the nationwide abolition (local-charity-ization) of the NHS in another post, but another approach to the problem would be to factor it (and the corresponding school and welfare and etc) systems down to council level. So you get the "Kent health service", the "Yorkshire health service", and so forth.