Is it OK for people living in poverty to have children?

youcanhandlethetruth · 28-07-2008, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony Butcher

There are far too many people who regard having children as a right, rather than a responsibility.

I think that another interesting question to ask would be:

Is it OK for people living in poverty to have children? (new thread)

You never mentioned poverty in your previous repsonse Anthony - you said something like a "stable and loving environment".

So are you saying that people living in poverty are unable to provide that ?
If so that's pure prejudice.

And what about the 3rd world ?

Are you going to eradicate the whole population of Africa and other less fortunate countries that have been economically supressed by our loving governments and prevent them from having children because they are poor ?

A crazy and misaligned argument.

brian pearson · 28-07-2008, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chikrodah

What about those who, through no fault of their own, find themselves on benefits due to the changing economic climate?

Then they will quite correctly get state aid until they are able to find employment again.

That is a world away from the state funded family who have no intention of looking for work. And please don't be so naive to think they are a small minority.

TannyD · 28-07-2008, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ea of Dune

I'm not advocating steralization or anything of that nature that would IMO be very wrong. At any rate that is not treating the root of the problem. People need to learn to be more responsible for themselves and the benefits system should be treated as a safety net, not as a cash machine that rewards people for sitting at home popping out sprogs.

Ea of dune

You are soo right, if people aren;t prepared to open their eyes and take responsibility then they will have to accept the stinging result of their actions or the lose of their personal freedoms in regards to restrictions on their right to breed.

Hartlepool · 28-07-2008, 07:19 PM

Chastity belts anyone?

GenghisChris · 28-07-2008, 10:25 PM

I honestly thought that a thread like this would be pointless, I would have presumed that everyone would have agreed that it would be wrong to tell people they can't have children.

how about if we take this further, is it OK for people with inheritable dieseases to have children? is it OK for disabled people to have children? or single parents? is it OK for black people to have children? how about jews? how about anyone whos genetic makeup doesnt include great height, blond hair and blue eyes?

These forums do tend to bring out peoples prejudices huh?

Ea of Dune · 28-07-2008, 10:38 PM

No I think people are simply advocating personal responsibility. Your argument Genghis Chris sounds much like a typical lefty argument. You take one subject and then try to stretch the boundries of the debate to cover race and disabled people etc.... it becomes very tiring.
Very often moving the boundries to cover other groups ends up closing down debate and moves it away from the original jist of conversation.
What the hell do Black people and Jewish people have to do with the argument about the people who bring around their own poverty through lazyness? I would imagine if you examined the demographics Jewish families are probably one of the lowest burdens upon society. The Jewish people I know have a strong sense of family and a strong work ethic.

I am not saying people should not have children, I am not saying people should have DNA test etc. in fact you are the only person to suggest this. I am not suggesting disabled people should not recieve support and help or that families who end up on the dole through economic downturn shouldn't recieve help.

I am saying that I do not want my quality of life damaged by people who think it is OK to keep having children at the expense of society. Not only do these thoughtless ***** cost us in the NHS they cost us right through until said child becomes eligable to pay tax.

Pray tell me why society should spend it scarce resources on paying for lazy usless scum bags children when those who have a genuine case are often denied a decent level of care because the feckless are using up resources that could be spent on guide dogs, deaf colleges etc?

There has to be an end to this. I know two single mothers who don't go out and work when they can and the state supports them. This has to stop.

Ea of dune

GenghisChris · 28-07-2008, 10:58 PM

I possibly looked at the question a bit differently to everyone else.

So far no-one has said that the ability to have children should be taken away from people, it was a simple question of should they be aloud to?

but what happens when enough people say they shouldn't have this right? then the cogs of democracy can start turning and before we know it we have a law banning people in poverty from having children.

The other examples I brought in were for a reason, I'm sure you would agree that jewish and black people should be aloud to raise as many children as they see fit however we both know others will have a different view point.

Its a way of letting others gain a new perspective of things, if it is so wrong to tell these people they can't have children surely it is just as wrong to tell people in poverty they can't.

So why should society support these people?

My opinion is in the long run the majority of people born in poverty and raised with the help of state handouts will end up paying back more in tax than they ever take out. therefore it makes sense to assist these poor folks.

The real problem occoured under margaret thatcher, it is the children raised under her government that are under-educated and worse off
This can be fixed and labour have tried and succeeded in some areas to fix this. Education is key!

London Orbital · 28-07-2008, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ea of Dune

I'm not advocating steralization or anything of that nature that would IMO be very wrong. At any rate that is not treating the root of the problem. People need to learn to be more responsible for themselves and the benefits system should be treated as a safety net, not as a cash machine that rewards people for sitting at home popping out sprogs.

Ea of dune

It rather depends on the level of benefits that are paid out.

Drastically reduce the amount (or remove such state benefits) and people will take more responsibility.

Encourage marriage as well through the tax system, and many families will start to become self supporting again.

State benefits are most often paid out to sustain broken families - or 'wives of the state' - in the form of single-parent families.

In the meantime of course ridiculous PC notions such as 'gay parenting' are countenanced, so no wonder so many people see it as their automatic right to have children. God forbid this 'right' should be denied anyone, even homosexuals.

But people would be less enthusiastic to exercise such 'rights' if they thought their kids might starve.

Reduce or remove state support and let charity - especially religious charities - fulfill the role of helping the children of the poor.

Then people will learn to be God-fearing again, as well as forming strong families which after all are the best protection against economic hardship.

youcanhandlethetruth · 29-07-2008, 12:57 AM

Quote: