Cameron has done it! He’s used the veto

[Road_Hog]

I think that says it all. You believe what you want to believe. It's Christmas soon anyway.

Are you saying that you believe the BBC to be unbiased and factual?

Here's one for you, from yesterday. Newsniffer monitors the changes in stories on the BBC website. What happens is that someone will post a factual report and then the Beeboids will come along and change it if it is not on message.

Take this one, where the Adam Smith Institute saying that green energy in Scotland is flawed. Of course we can't have anyone knocking green energy, certainly not at the BBC. So the headline is changed, as is much of the text, so it fits in with BBC propaganda.

'Scottish Renewables slams 'flawed' energy report' diff viewer (0/1) - News Sniffer

[CB100]

If the BBC was saying one thing and all the other major media outlets the opposite, I would be very sceptical of their report.

However, given that all the main media outlets in the UK are saying pretty much the same thing, I think it is safe to accept the consensus. I posted up a Sky News link as an example so its obviously not just the BBC saying it.

Look, it's obvious you have a big anti tory / cameron thing. That's all fine but just don't expect other people to be persuaded by your semantics.

Yes strictly speaking it was not a veto. So what? The effect is to stop an EU wide treaty.

Are you saying that you believe the BBC to be unbiased and factual?

Here's one for you, from yesterday. Newsniffer monitors the changes in stories on the BBC website. What happens is that someone will post a factual report and then the Beeboids will come along and change it if it is not on message.

Take this one, where the Adam Smith Institute saying that green energy in Scotland is flawed. Of course we can't have anyone knocking green energy, certainly not at the BBC. So the headline is changed, as is much of the text, so it fits in with BBC propaganda.

'Scottish Renewables slams 'flawed' energy report' diff viewer (0/1) - News Sniffer

[Road_Hog]

Look, it's obvious you have a big anti tory / cameron thing. That's all fine but just don't expect other people to be persuaded by your semantics.

That couldn't be further from the truth, I've voted Tory in most of the general elections that I've voted in. Cameron isn't a Tory though.

[CB100]

Well fine. At least your agenda is clear now anyway.

I tend to agree DC isn't a tory but I think he does a reasonable job. The main focus now has to be dealing with the deficit. I appreciate many people get worked up about the EU but now is just not the time to be getting into internal rows within the tory party.

Personally I would like to see an In/Out referendum on the EU after 2015 but not before. Trying to do it now will just cause the coalition to fall apart and risks Labour getting back in. Labour have caused huge damage to the UK and we need a long break from them.

That couldn't be further from the truth, I've voted Tory in most of the general elections that I've voted in. Cameron isn't a Tory though.

[Baron von Lotsov]

Personally I support more genuine democracy ie more involvement of the electorate in the big decisions. At least then, the electorate would be forced to accept the outcome of their decisions, good or bad, instead of blaming politicians for everything.

Well then, the first thing that you need to insist on is to oppose the dumbing down at schools. The Left control education.

[CB100]

I don't think that has anything to do with it.

What I am saying is dumb or not, the electorate should be given the right to make the decisions. If the electorate make the wrong choices for whatever reason (including being poorly educated) tough. We just have to accept it.

Much better than blaming politicians for getting it wrong.

Well then, the first thing that you need to insist on is to oppose the dumbing down at schools. The Left control education.

[Matron]

What I am saying is dumb or not, the electorate should be given the right to make the decisions. If the electorate make the wrong choices for whatever reason (including being poorly educated) tough. We just have to accept it.

I agree, so let's have an in/out referendum NOW.

[CB100]

Nice icon - Hattie

Personally I would prefer to have it after 2015 when the EU problems have calmed down and there is more chance of the electorate going for an "Out" decision.

I agree, so let's have an in/out referendum NOW.

[Matron]

Nice icon - Hattie

Thanks

Personally I would prefer to have it after 2015 when the EU problems have calmed down and there is more chance of the electorate going for an "Out" decision.

If the EU problems have calmed down by 2015, I'd have thought that there would be less chance of the electorate going for an "Out" decision.

[CB100]

If the EU problems have calmed down by 2015, I'd have thought that there would be less chance of the electorate going for an "Out" decision.

Well I don't know for sure obviously. But I think if we had a referendum now you would have all 3 main party leaders laying it in thick about how the sky will fall in. Just to refer back to your icon, the old adage, “always keep a-hold of Nurse, for fear of finding something worse”.....

If things have calmed down in a few years, the issues won't have gone away and if anything the electorate will be even more wound up with dealing with the EU federalists.

But I accept it's just an opinion and I could be wrong.