My Intro

doc_cruel · 09-12-2004, 08:03 PM

This is about me, what I believe and why.... feel free to rip it shreds (Derek :wink: ) but I try to give as good as I get!

Ok... i'm a 22 year old computer programmer who lives in Central London(though I grew up in Folkestone, kent) - I go to uni though also run work a lot as a freelance coder to try to make end meet! I used to play quite a high standard of rugby before injury ended it - I now gym, kickbox and enjoy late night sessions with my computer (at the annoyance of my GF.... who is a model by the way 8) )

I dont like arrogance, I hate it more when Yanks in Rome ask me if I Speak American.... It's called English fat boy, we invented it, it's our language not yours.
- I think Blair is semi-right when he says Britain is a bridge between the US & EU in that both walk over us!

I think we should be respectful of the people's cultures and always take the moral higher ground when we can.

I dont like red tape. I dont like meaningless barriers that cost me money. Although I'm obvious not keen of the EU I'm probably the only UKIP supporter who like to see the UK join the Euro! Over 30% of my clients are in europe and it is a pain trying to estimate currency movements for quotes knowing full well in reality it's totally unpredictable!

I dont believe in sterotypes, I believe there's more good in this world then bad. I enjoy life and I think the future of this country is good.

Anthony Butcher · 09-12-2004, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Although I'm obvious not keen of the EU I'm probably the only UKIP supporter who like to see the UK join the Euro! Over 30% of my clients are in europe and it is a pain trying to estimate currency movements for quotes knowing full well in reality it's totally unpredictable!

That's a rather limited view of what the Euro will do for you! :?

Quote:

I think we should be respectful of the people's cultures and always take the moral higher ground when we can.

That is an interesting issue that RKS has really brought up - should we compare and judge other cultures in comaprison to ours. The politically correct answer is that we shouldn't, but this has led to the ridiculous situation of some RKS critics effectively defending the human rights abuses of some Arab states.

That is a little unfair on his critics, but they haven't applied enough common sense. Their agenda seems to be to criticise him, rather than actually listening to what he is saying.

Personally, I don't think that a comparison between cultures is sensible; we are just as guilty now or in our history of most undesirable activities from other cultures and nations. However, I think that we are perfectly entitled to make personal judgements on what behaviour we consider to be reprehensible, just as we do in our own country.

mkpdavies · 10-12-2004, 06:11 AM

Sorry, just to make this clear in my head. You would happily see all our controls over our economy handed over, all gold reserves, ability to tune interest rates, and give away one of the most stable currencies in the world, so that you have 1 less fluctuation to worry about, in a business world full of fluctuations?

Funny how people have different perspectives!

I think you could be possibly the only UKIP member who does want the Euro!

BTW I have never heard people ask do I speak American, how many times have you had that asked?

doc_cruel · 10-12-2004, 12:29 PM

mkp - you're right to say we'd loose control of our interest rates although the consequences of this has definitely been overplayed in the media.

Interest rates are simple the recommended level that people lend money at; Going with the logic that more people owe money then lend money raising interest rates can (and is) used as a tool to lower inflation.

However it doesn't work very well.... a lot of financial institutions don't adjust their rates accordingly, effects are disproportionate (just look at the cost of a house here in the UK to anywhere else in the world) and then it doesn't take INTO phpbb_account local issues (which is why council tax is so high in the south east as this is the only mechanism the government have of doing this)!

The largest economies in the world use a localised taxation system; in the US every state can adjust their model for local economical conditions. Interest rates simply aren't needed to be changed as much as they are here.

As for the reasons of joining the Euro; I remember 3 years ago just after it's launch when the value of the Euro was worth about 1/3 less than it was now. During that time I signed a large contract with a Finnish company but by the time the project was finished the value of sterling had dropped! Although the project was delivered on time, above specification & the client was happy I actually lost money. It ****** me off no end! I spent 4 months solidly working but because I was based in Britain not Europe I actually needn't have bothered!

- I know it can go either way, but given the fact the vast majority of our exports (about 70-odd %) go to other parts of Europe I'm sure everyone agrees in a modern globalised world Sterling is a needless financial risk British companies don't need.

As for saying Sterling is stable - stable compared to what? The value of Sterling against the Dollar and Euro is many things but stable!

I haven't heard that the UK would have to give up our gold to join the single currency.... for starters I thought the BoE has sold most of it off during Major's time!

If I my way...Britain would be regionalised with a streamline central government in Westminster. The regions would be able to make local changes to their taxation... competition is a good thing for consumers and it would force each region to be efficient! Britain would leave the EU but adopt the Euro which means given our superior business ethos (and a common currency) would all but guarantee companies from all over the continent would be rushing to set up their HQs here!

Twas asked if I spoke American a couple of times in the Summer at Rome, nice enough people and sure they didn't mean to offend but is a perfect example of the indicative nature of Americans at the moment.

mkpdavies · 10-12-2004, 12:52 PM

It's swings and roundabouts with currency. Even if we were in the Euro, you would still have fluctuations with the rest of the world. Sometimes it is bad for you, sometimes it is good.

I bought my car in Holland, at the time I ordered it would have been about 15k for a brand new Subaru Impreza. Bargain I thought, but by the time I handed over the cash the Euro had sunk to a record low and I only hand over 12K

I can't deny that the business world benefits from one less fluctation to think about, but the cost is too much. I think you are way too flippant with you comments on interest rates. It is essential to an economy to be able to influence spending, investment etc etc. Don't forget the Euro is subject to them just as much as Sterling. Only Sterling gets the rates that OUR country needs, the EURO gets the rates that whoever has the sway of power at the time needs.

Sterling is not a financial risk, if you look at currencies in the world, Sterling does not move as much and is based on a rock solid system that is accountable and passes it's audits every year. Look how the Euro has gone from worthless to ultra high against the other big currency, the Dollar. The UK is not it the same boat now as the Euro using countries as our currency has sat in the middle between the Dollar and Euro, this is the most stable position to be in.

Your quote of 70% of exports are for manufactured goods, and the percentage of the UK economy that this accounts for really is tiny. With China and other emerging economies on the up this figure will shrink, and become even less important to a broadly service based industry. If we were in the Euro now, our service industry which is much more global would be suffering due to it's overvaluation. Thats the great thing about being independent, we can stear are economy much more efficiently with our needs in mind.

Business in Britain is becoming more and more against the Euro every day. There are a few businesses like yours perhaps, which are confined to trade with Europe, that see it as all important. The good of the whole however is far more important, and the fact that fluctuations iron themselves out in the end, make it even more essential that we stay in control of our own economy.

mkpdavies · 10-12-2004, 01:20 PM

Here is some useful information. Sorry the format is a bit off. First figures are export services, import services second column. Note how our exports are in the black! Also note that per person we really are kicking some butt in the world. The US is the size of Europe combined, so they should be more than double us by a long way.

Britain kicks butt, be proud of the fact. We don't need to be part of any of the EU project.

See http://www.wto.org/english/res_e/sta...overview_e.htm for lots of great stats that will warm the heart and make you realise how Britain really sits in the world!

Leading exporters and importers in world trade in commercial services, 2003
(Billion dollars and percentage)
Annual Annual
percentage percentage
Rank Exporters Value Share change Rank Importers Value Share change

1 United States 287.7 16.0 5 1 United States 228.5 12.8 8
2 United Kingdom 143.4 8.0 11 2 Germany 170.8 9.6 17
3 Germany 115.6 6.4 18 3 United Kingdom 118.3 6.6 13
4 France 98.9 5.5 15 4 Japan 110.3 6.2 3
5 Spain 76.3 4.2 23 5 France 83.7 4.7 22
6 Italy 72.7 4.0 22 6 Italy 74.0 4.2 20
7 Japan a 70.6 3.9 9 7 Netherlands 64.9 3.6 15
8 Netherlands 63.0 3.5 15 8 China 54.9 3.1 19
9 China 46.4 2.6 18 9 Ireland 50.2 2.8 24
10 Hong Kong, China 44.6 2.5 4 10 Canada 50.0 2.8 12

jp · 10-12-2004, 02:55 PM

The core problem with a single currency is that there has to be one interest rate. One interest rate means that it will be too high for parts of single currency area and too low in others,

This leads to boom in one place and bust in another.

How is this managed in, say the USA? They have mobility of labour across the whole of the states and large federal funds to support failing areas.

Neither of these are apparent in Euroland (unless you favour giving our friends in Brussels a mega budget and convincing itallians that they want to move to Helsinki)

Please note; this is an example, no Finns were harmed in drawing this comparison!!

doc_cruel · 13-12-2004, 02:28 PM

Sorry for my lack of replies in the last few days - I've been snowed under in paper work and had to ban myself from non-essential net

JP - you right about the problems with a single interest rate (I think I went INTO phpbb_this in my other post) the one size fits all policy certainly doesn't work for the UK at the moment yet alone Europe. Britain is I think the only developed country to rely so heavily on interest rates to control inflation.... Most mortgages are fixed in other parts of Europe and the US which means interest rates have little effect.
- the US controls their economy with local taxation systems that are set at state level... states compete against each other (which is why you'll see adverts for people to move to say... Nevada in California) and this ensures administration is kept efficient.

I'd say there's been a lot of migration in Europe... if you go to parts of Spain or even parts of London you'll see quite how cosmopolitan it is!

Your link regarding the place we sit in the world regarding commerce underlines my point exactly why it's important that to ensure currency stability! We have a lot of skills in the financial area; the infrastructure to support it and the city is one of the best trading arena in the world.... but what would happen if sterling was to gain 1/3 in value to the dollar or euro (very possible). Every single $ or € poured INTO phpbb_our financial sector would be worth 1/3 less and would really hurt our economy.
There's only so much pulling power skills & infrastructure have.

MKP - you a subaru guy? bit too powerful for me to get insurance for about 10 years I think!
Sterling is a well managed currency I'll agree when certainly compaired to the dollar (with the massive us surpless)....

mkpdavies · 13-12-2004, 02:33 PM

Yep, I love my Scooby! It was a real sweetener to turning 30, to see my insurance shrink for the first time, and by a considerable amount! The fact I have never had any kind of accident (touch wood), didn't seem to count for much!

doc_cruel · 13-12-2004, 04:03 PM

They certainly are nice cars. I've done some work for a guy that imports Japanese sports cars and he has some sweet models!

What version Impreza you got?

09-12-2004, 08:03 PM	#1 (permalink)
doc_cruel Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 213	My Intro This is about me, what I believe and why.... feel free to rip it shreds (Derek :wink: ) but I try to give as good as I get! Ok... i'm a 22 year old computer programmer who lives in Central London(though I grew up in Folkestone, kent) - I go to uni though also run work a lot as a freelance coder to try to make end meet! I used to play quite a high standard of rugby before injury ended it - I now gym, kickbox and enjoy late night sessions with my computer (at the annoyance of my GF.... who is a model by the way 8) ) I dont like arrogance, I hate it more when Yanks in Rome ask me if I Speak American.... It's called English fat boy, we invented it, it's our language not yours. - I think Blair is semi-right when he says Britain is a bridge between the US & EU in that both walk over us! I think we should be respectful of the people's cultures and always take the moral higher ground when we can. I dont like red tape. I dont like meaningless barriers that cost me money. Although I'm obvious not keen of the EU I'm probably the only UKIP supporter who like to see the UK join the Euro! Over 30% of my clients are in europe and it is a pain trying to estimate currency movements for quotes knowing full well in reality it's totally unpredictable! I dont believe in sterotypes, I believe there's more good in this world then bad. I enjoy life and I think the future of this country is good.

10-12-2004, 06:11 AM	#3 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,604	Sorry, just to make this clear in my head. You would happily see all our controls over our economy handed over, all gold reserves, ability to tune interest rates, and give away one of the most stable currencies in the world, so that you have 1 less fluctuation to worry about, in a business world full of fluctuations? Funny how people have different perspectives! I think you could be possibly the only UKIP member who does want the Euro! BTW I have never heard people ask do I speak American, how many times have you had that asked? __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

10-12-2004, 12:52 PM	#5 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,604	It's swings and roundabouts with currency. Even if we were in the Euro, you would still have fluctuations with the rest of the world. Sometimes it is bad for you, sometimes it is good. I bought my car in Holland, at the time I ordered it would have been about 15k for a brand new Subaru Impreza. Bargain I thought, but by the time I handed over the cash the Euro had sunk to a record low and I only hand over 12K I can't deny that the business world benefits from one less fluctation to think about, but the cost is too much. I think you are way too flippant with you comments on interest rates. It is essential to an economy to be able to influence spending, investment etc etc. Don't forget the Euro is subject to them just as much as Sterling. Only Sterling gets the rates that OUR country needs, the EURO gets the rates that whoever has the sway of power at the time needs. Sterling is not a financial risk, if you look at currencies in the world, Sterling does not move as much and is based on a rock solid system that is accountable and passes it's audits every year. Look how the Euro has gone from worthless to ultra high against the other big currency, the Dollar. The UK is not it the same boat now as the Euro using countries as our currency has sat in the middle between the Dollar and Euro, this is the most stable position to be in. Your quote of 70% of exports are for manufactured goods, and the percentage of the UK economy that this accounts for really is tiny. With China and other emerging economies on the up this figure will shrink, and become even less important to a broadly service based industry. If we were in the Euro now, our service industry which is much more global would be suffering due to it's overvaluation. Thats the great thing about being independent, we can stear are economy much more efficiently with our needs in mind. Business in Britain is becoming more and more against the Euro every day. There are a few businesses like yours perhaps, which are confined to trade with Europe, that see it as all important. The good of the whole however is far more important, and the fact that fluctuations iron themselves out in the end, make it even more essential that we stay in control of our own economy. __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

10-12-2004, 01:20 PM	#6 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,604	Here is some useful information. Sorry the format is a bit off. First figures are export services, import services second column. Note how our exports are in the black! Also note that per person we really are kicking some butt in the world. The US is the size of Europe combined, so they should be more than double us by a long way. Britain kicks butt, be proud of the fact. We don't need to be part of any of the EU project. See http://www.wto.org/english/res_e/sta...overview_e.htm for lots of great stats that will warm the heart and make you realise how Britain really sits in the world! Leading exporters and importers in world trade in commercial services, 2003 (Billion dollars and percentage) Annual Annual percentage percentage Rank Exporters Value Share change Rank Importers Value Share change 1 United States 287.7 16.0 5 1 United States 228.5 12.8 8 2 United Kingdom 143.4 8.0 11 2 Germany 170.8 9.6 17 3 Germany 115.6 6.4 18 3 United Kingdom 118.3 6.6 13 4 France 98.9 5.5 15 4 Japan 110.3 6.2 3 5 Spain 76.3 4.2 23 5 France 83.7 4.7 22 6 Italy 72.7 4.0 22 6 Italy 74.0 4.2 20 7 Japan a 70.6 3.9 9 7 Netherlands 64.9 3.6 15 8 Netherlands 63.0 3.5 15 8 China 54.9 3.1 19 9 China 46.4 2.6 18 9 Ireland 50.2 2.8 24 10 Hong Kong, China 44.6 2.5 4 10 Canada 50.0 2.8 12 __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

13-12-2004, 02:33 PM	#9 (permalink)
mkpdavies Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Woking Posts: 30,604	Yep, I love my Scooby! It was a real sweetener to turning 30, to see my insurance shrink for the first time, and by a considerable amount! The fact I have never had any kind of accident (touch wood), didn't seem to count for much! __________________ http://brits4ronpaul.blogspot.com/ http://wokinglibertarians.blogspot.com/ http://lpuk.org My ignore list Labour, Blue Labour, Lib Dems

10-12-2004, 12:29 PM	#4 (permalink)
doc_cruel Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 213	mkp - you're right to say we'd loose control of our interest rates although the consequences of this has definitely been overplayed in the media. Interest rates are simple the recommended level that people lend money at; Going with the logic that more people owe money then lend money raising interest rates can (and is) used as a tool to lower inflation. However it doesn't work very well.... a lot of financial institutions don't adjust their rates accordingly, effects are disproportionate (just look at the cost of a house here in the UK to anywhere else in the world) and then it doesn't take INTO phpbb_account local issues (which is why council tax is so high in the south east as this is the only mechanism the government have of doing this)! The largest economies in the world use a localised taxation system; in the US every state can adjust their model for local economical conditions. Interest rates simply aren't needed to be changed as much as they are here. As for the reasons of joining the Euro; I remember 3 years ago just after it's launch when the value of the Euro was worth about 1/3 less than it was now. During that time I signed a large contract with a Finnish company but by the time the project was finished the value of sterling had dropped! Although the project was delivered on time, above specification & the client was happy I actually lost money. It ****** me off no end! I spent 4 months solidly working but because I was based in Britain not Europe I actually needn't have bothered! - I know it can go either way, but given the fact the vast majority of our exports (about 70-odd %) go to other parts of Europe I'm sure everyone agrees in a modern globalised world Sterling is a needless financial risk British companies don't need. As for saying Sterling is stable - stable compared to what? The value of Sterling against the Dollar and Euro is many things but stable! I haven't heard that the UK would have to give up our gold to join the single currency.... for starters I thought the BoE has sold most of it off during Major's time! If I my way...Britain would be regionalised with a streamline central government in Westminster. The regions would be able to make local changes to their taxation... competition is a good thing for consumers and it would force each region to be efficient! Britain would leave the EU but adopt the Euro which means given our superior business ethos (and a common currency) would all but guarantee companies from all over the continent would be rushing to set up their HQs here! Twas asked if I spoke American a couple of times in the Summer at Rome, nice enough people and sure they didn't mean to offend but is a perfect example of the indicative nature of Americans at the moment.

10-12-2004, 02:55 PM	#7 (permalink)
jp Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,000	The core problem with a single currency is that there has to be one interest rate. One interest rate means that it will be too high for parts of single currency area and too low in others, This leads to boom in one place and bust in another. How is this managed in, say the USA? They have mobility of labour across the whole of the states and large federal funds to support failing areas. Neither of these are apparent in Euroland (unless you favour giving our friends in Brussels a mega budget and convincing itallians that they want to move to Helsinki) Please note; this is an example, no Finns were harmed in drawing this comparison!!

13-12-2004, 02:28 PM	#8 (permalink)
doc_cruel Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 213	Sorry for my lack of replies in the last few days - I've been snowed under in paper work and had to ban myself from non-essential net JP - you right about the problems with a single interest rate (I think I went INTO phpbb_this in my other post) the one size fits all policy certainly doesn't work for the UK at the moment yet alone Europe. Britain is I think the only developed country to rely so heavily on interest rates to control inflation.... Most mortgages are fixed in other parts of Europe and the US which means interest rates have little effect. - the US controls their economy with local taxation systems that are set at state level... states compete against each other (which is why you'll see adverts for people to move to say... Nevada in California) and this ensures administration is kept efficient. I'd say there's been a lot of migration in Europe... if you go to parts of Spain or even parts of London you'll see quite how cosmopolitan it is! Your link regarding the place we sit in the world regarding commerce underlines my point exactly why it's important that to ensure currency stability! We have a lot of skills in the financial area; the infrastructure to support it and the city is one of the best trading arena in the world.... but what would happen if sterling was to gain 1/3 in value to the dollar or euro (very possible). Every single $ or € poured INTO phpbb_our financial sector would be worth 1/3 less and would really hurt our economy. There's only so much pulling power skills & infrastructure have. MKP - you a subaru guy? bit too powerful for me to get insurance for about 10 years I think! Sterling is a well managed currency I'll agree when certainly compaired to the dollar (with the massive us surpless)....

13-12-2004, 04:03 PM	#10 (permalink)
doc_cruel Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 213	They certainly are nice cars. I've done some work for a guy that imports Japanese sports cars and he has some sweet models! What version Impreza you got?

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