Theres a full blown revolt happening in the USA!!! Tell Everyone!!

youcanhandlethetruth · 11-02-2008, 07:00 PM

Aardvark,

You say:
"I'm happy to believe that a group of disgruntled Pakistanis were stupid enough to believe that they were going to change the world. The net is full of self-centred nutters who believe that the world's population is quaking in its boots after a long hard ignore of their websites."

Yes you said it you are "happy to believe that" - it fits your conditioned view of the world that you are too frightened to examine might just possibly be wrong....

Have you looked at the scientific evidence ? I seriously doubt it - so you resort to namecalling because that is easier than dealing with the hard facts.

I understand to a degree because it is a natural reaction to say "Oh that sounds crazy - I can't believe there are people who would do that" - well people thought Hitler was quite a nice guy too didn't they to begin with ?

Prison Planet - 9/11 Prior Knowledge Archive
Alex Jones' Warning A CALL TO ACTION!

Now of course you're totally wrong and misguided.
But even if you are right and we are a bunch of "nutters" or "conspiracy theorists" then so are all these high profile people(that you rarely if ever hear mentioned on the TV news):
And don't think "Well the TV says it isn't" because it is more lies and propaganda.

Filmmaker Michael Moore Now Says 9/11 Could Be Inside Job
Former MI5 Agent Says 9/11 An Inside Job
Former German Minister Says Building 7 Used To Run 9/11 Attack
Boston Air Traffic Controller Says 9/11 An Inside Job
NY Fireman Lou Cacchioli Says 9/11 Comission Twisted His Words
Charlie Sheen Says 9/11 Movement "Juggernaut Of Truth"
Representative Of Largest 9/11 Families Group Says Government Complicit In Attack
Former Head Of Star Wars Program Says Cheney Main 9/11 Suspect
Charlie Sheen Says Media Complicit In 9/11 Cover-Up
Prominent Physics Professor Refutes “Official” 9/11 Story

I'll be delighted to hear your reply, but I suspect you won't have the guts to admit you might be wrong, despite the weight of evidence that no doubt you will convince yourself isn't worth even examining....

But on top of all this evidence do you seriously expect us to believe that a bunch of hijackers and at best amateur pilots overtook a domestic aircraft with boxcutters, managed to fly penetrate the most heavily fortified airspace in the world(domestic flights are routinely intercepted) do an almost impossible U turn and fly with absolute precision into the Twin Towers ?

I MEAN COME ON ! If that's not a "conspiracy theory" I don't know what is....

And how did Building 7 collapse after not being hit by anything, and why did the BBC report it had fallen 20 minutes before it did with the building standing behind the reporter ? And most of the hijackers you believe carried it out, showed up alive and well after the attack !

With the massive amount of evidence staring you in the face, if you don't change your opinion, then I believe you personally don't deserve to see any change..

I'm afraid every one has got to swallow their pride, examine the massive amount of evidence and admit to being misled and lied to by government and the mainstream media.

Unless of course you want to be a slave to the elite...

P.S Davis Cameron/Tories/Labour won't do a thing for you....
I'm not trying to hack you off - I'M TRYING TO HELP YOU......

Ok I'm waiting for it to go all very quiet......

Aardvark · 12-02-2008, 09:50 AM

YCHTT, the 'nutters' were the young Pakistani lads. Their deaths achieved nothing for their 'cause'. Nobody woke up the day after the attacks and decided, on the basis of them, to convert to Islam, in fact they turned people away.

Not everything done in 'al Qaeda's' name is really organised by, or part of, al Qaeda. It's an amorphous umbrella group. It's like people independently choosing to blow up abortion clinics in the name of Christ - uncoordinated and not every action winning supporters to the greater cause.

I've looked at some of the links provided and there is still idle speculation. I don't rate Shayler because of his agenda, Charlie Sheen's opinion is as valid as that of Tom Cruse, Dustin Hoffman or Florence from the Magic Roundabout. Just because somebody is a celebrity does not mean he is privy to what is happening in the world and does not validate his opinion.

I remain very sceptical. I do look at the big picture and ask cui bono. Certainly amongst the beneficiaries seem to be the hawks who want to take us into war with everyone who upsets Israel. That doesn't mean they did it.

Have the 9/11 attackers really been seen out and about? When, where and by whom?

Were the names not on the pax manifests? Show me a copy of the pax manifests with links and commentary.

What near impossible 'U-turn'? All jet aircraft turns through 180 degrees form a U, give or take the impact of wind speed. That's what I used to put on my charts when I flew jet aircraft as a navigator. I won't go into the physics of the effect of height and pressure on aircraft speed, but basically the lower down an aircraft the tighter the turn that is achievable for the same indicated airspeed (IAS).

Re the instructors comments on inability to fly a Cessna - Oddly it is harder to fly a small aircraft such as a Cessna with precision because of the effect of variables such as wind and turbulence creating terrain on the lighter airframe and the frequent lack of precision avionics. Propeller aircraft are more susceptible to yaw from the effects of the prop than jet engines. Keeping the ball in the middle is an artform that was lost on me during my brief attempt to become a military pilot. The propeller has to be countered by a hefty boot of the foot to control the rudder otherwise you do what I did and take off sideways (and almost hit a bus passing the airfield!). Lift/weight, thrust/drag explain it all.

Although there is a lot of circumstantial 'evidence' there are gaps in the arguments. Why would someone in a tight knit conspiracy place 'bets' on the stocks of the airlines in question? That would draw attention, as it apparently has. If there was supposed to be a full scale military coup, as alleged, there was never going to be a guarantee that any stock would rise or fall.

I think the key to 'winning' this argument is not to root around for every potential thread of a conspiracy, but concentrate on one clearly identifiable element that sceptics will trust in. Christ showed his spear wound to 'Doubting' Thomas rather than wasting time with naming his mother's cat and reminding him of the day he wore odd socks at a stoning.

Aardvark · 12-02-2008, 09:58 AM

BTW, anyone who puts 'embellished' on his flight plan is available to be intercepted by military aircraft for training purposes. This helps the fighter controllers practise talking fighters onto realtime targets. I've been 'routinely' intercepted; that was the plan.

Frith · 12-02-2008, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aardvark

Millions of people worldwide will not sign up to this. The video deals with issues that relate to the US only. I have enough problems with the taxman without making a pointless statement.

Nobody in the UK can have an effect on the US laws.

If guns are taken in the US how will my rights be affected?

I want the ownership of handguns to be legalised in this country, but I want serious controls. Given the f@ckwits currently roaming our country the last thing we need is to give them the 'right' to bear arms, a right incidentally granted at a time when the majority in some states (New York for instance) were still loyal to the Crown and could not be relied on not to have a counter-revolution and when the natives were still upset by the dispossession being generated by their land being stolen and given to 'illegal' white immigrants.

The right to bear arms incidentally was granted by people who hunted native Americans for sport (Andrew Jackson) and who owned black human beings as slaves (George Washington). It was not a universal right, nor was the right to be equal or to be free - ask the blacks and native Americans how they were equal? Slavery was abolished in 1865, but blacks in Florida were still denied votes as recently as 2000.

Income tax 'illegal'? Federal reserve 'illegal'? These are not issues even discussed in most of the world. Income tax was introduced to fight a war with the French - hardly illegal or immoral.

This demonstrates the way US conspiracy theorists don't understand how anybody else in the world thinks. I've spent half of the last year observing elections around the world (Albania, Armenia, Kazakhstan, Ukraine and Georgia) and the Federal reserve, income tax, the right to bear arms etc were not in any manifestos.

Agree with you Aardvark that conspiracy theorists are ruining campaigns for reasonable causes and they are making these campaigners look like idiots. Often they are merely trying to foment violence by scaremongering.

It takes all sorts, but all sorts shouldn't be taken.

youcanhandlethetruth · 12-02-2008, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aardvark

YCHTT, the 'nutters' were the young Pakistani lads. Their deaths achieved nothing for their 'cause'. Nobody woke up the day after the attacks and decided, on the basis of them, to convert to Islam, in fact they turned people away.

Not everything done in 'al Qaeda's' name is really organised by, or part of, al Qaeda. It's an amorphous umbrella group. It's like people independently choosing to blow up abortion clinics in the name of Christ - uncoordinated and not every action winning supporters to the greater cause.

I've looked at some of the links provided and there is still idle speculation. I don't rate Shayler because of his agenda, Charlie Sheen's opinion is as valid as that of Tom Cruse, Dustin Hoffman or Florence from the Magic Roundabout. Just because somebody is a celebrity does not mean he is privy to what is happening in the world and does not validate his opinion.

I remain very sceptical. I do look at the big picture and ask cui bono. Certainly amongst the beneficiaries seem to be the hawks who want to take us into war with everyone who upsets Israel. That doesn't mean they did it.

Have the 9/11 attackers really been seen out and about? When, where and by whom?

Were the names not on the pax manifests? Show me a copy of the pax manifests with links and commentary.

What near impossible 'U-turn'? All jet aircraft turns through 180 degrees form a U, give or take the impact of wind speed. That's what I used to put on my charts when I flew jet aircraft as a navigator. I won't go into the physics of the effect of height and pressure on aircraft speed, but basically the lower down an aircraft the tighter the turn that is achievable for the same indicated airspeed (IAS).

Re the instructors comments on inability to fly a Cessna - Oddly it is harder to fly a small aircraft such as a Cessna with precision because of the effect of variables such as wind and turbulence creating terrain on the lighter airframe and the frequent lack of precision avionics. Propeller aircraft are more susceptible to yaw from the effects of the prop than jet engines. Keeping the ball in the middle is an artform that was lost on me during my brief attempt to become a military pilot. The propeller has to be countered by a hefty boot of the foot to control the rudder otherwise you do what I did and take off sideways (and almost hit a bus passing the airfield!). Lift/weight, thrust/drag explain it all.

Although there is a lot of circumstantial 'evidence' there are gaps in the arguments. Why would someone in a tight knit conspiracy place 'bets' on the stocks of the airlines in question? That would draw attention, as it apparently has. If there was supposed to be a full scale military coup, as alleged, there was never going to be a guarantee that any stock would rise or fall.

I think the key to 'winning' this argument is not to root around for every potential thread of a conspiracy, but concentrate on one clearly identifiable element that sceptics will trust in. Christ showed his spear wound to 'Doubting' Thomas rather than wasting time with naming his mother's cat and reminding him of the day he wore odd socks at a stoning.

I'm not saying you should beleive celebrities - just pointing out that it's not just so called "conspiracy nutters" but a number of high profile people, including professors, scientists AND celebrities.

If as you say we are all conspiracy theorists then there one heck of a lot of them......

Scientific Poll: 84% Say 9/11 Is A Cover Up

BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Hijack 'suspects' alive and well

"If there was supposed to be a full scale military coup, as alleged, there was never going to be a guarantee that any stock would rise or fall." - that's a flimsy argument, it's clearly insider trading and to say it couldn't exist, is I believe, naive to say the least.

As for "Al-CIA da" well....
Existence of "Al-Qaeda" Is ****; Quite Literally

U.S. Intel Officer: Al Qaeda Leadership Allowed To Operate Freely

Former Blair Minister Points Out Al-Qaeda Cia Ties

12-02-2008, 09:50 AM	#22 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,565	YCHTT, the 'nutters' were the young Pakistani lads. Their deaths achieved nothing for their 'cause'. Nobody woke up the day after the attacks and decided, on the basis of them, to convert to Islam, in fact they turned people away. Not everything done in 'al Qaeda's' name is really organised by, or part of, al Qaeda. It's an amorphous umbrella group. It's like people independently choosing to blow up abortion clinics in the name of Christ - uncoordinated and not every action winning supporters to the greater cause. I've looked at some of the links provided and there is still idle speculation. I don't rate Shayler because of his agenda, Charlie Sheen's opinion is as valid as that of Tom Cruse, Dustin Hoffman or Florence from the Magic Roundabout. Just because somebody is a celebrity does not mean he is privy to what is happening in the world and does not validate his opinion. I remain very sceptical. I do look at the big picture and ask cui bono. Certainly amongst the beneficiaries seem to be the hawks who want to take us into war with everyone who upsets Israel. That doesn't mean they did it. Have the 9/11 attackers really been seen out and about? When, where and by whom? Were the names not on the pax manifests? Show me a copy of the pax manifests with links and commentary. What near impossible 'U-turn'? All jet aircraft turns through 180 degrees form a U, give or take the impact of wind speed. That's what I used to put on my charts when I flew jet aircraft as a navigator. I won't go into the physics of the effect of height and pressure on aircraft speed, but basically the lower down an aircraft the tighter the turn that is achievable for the same indicated airspeed (IAS). Re the instructors comments on inability to fly a Cessna - Oddly it is harder to fly a small aircraft such as a Cessna with precision because of the effect of variables such as wind and turbulence creating terrain on the lighter airframe and the frequent lack of precision avionics. Propeller aircraft are more susceptible to yaw from the effects of the prop than jet engines. Keeping the ball in the middle is an artform that was lost on me during my brief attempt to become a military pilot. The propeller has to be countered by a hefty boot of the foot to control the rudder otherwise you do what I did and take off sideways (and almost hit a bus passing the airfield!). Lift/weight, thrust/drag explain it all. Although there is a lot of circumstantial 'evidence' there are gaps in the arguments. Why would someone in a tight knit conspiracy place 'bets' on the stocks of the airlines in question? That would draw attention, as it apparently has. If there was supposed to be a full scale military coup, as alleged, there was never going to be a guarantee that any stock would rise or fall. I think the key to 'winning' this argument is not to root around for every potential thread of a conspiracy, but concentrate on one clearly identifiable element that sceptics will trust in. Christ showed his spear wound to 'Doubting' Thomas rather than wasting time with naming his mother's cat and reminding him of the day he wore odd socks at a stoning. __________________ When in Woking do as the Wokes do. "I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008

12-02-2008, 09:58 AM	#23 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,565	BTW, anyone who puts 'embellished' on his flight plan is available to be intercepted by military aircraft for training purposes. This helps the fighter controllers practise talking fighters onto realtime targets. I've been 'routinely' intercepted; that was the plan. __________________ When in Woking do as the Wokes do. "I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008

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11-02-2008, 07:00 PM	#21 (permalink)
youcanhandlethetruth Uber Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 2,044	Aardvark, You say: "I'm happy to believe that a group of disgruntled Pakistanis were stupid enough to believe that they were going to change the world. The net is full of self-centred nutters who believe that the world's population is quaking in its boots after a long hard ignore of their websites." Yes you said it you are "happy to believe that" - it fits your conditioned view of the world that you are too frightened to examine might just possibly be wrong.... Have you looked at the scientific evidence ? I seriously doubt it - so you resort to namecalling because that is easier than dealing with the hard facts. I understand to a degree because it is a natural reaction to say "Oh that sounds crazy - I can't believe there are people who would do that" - well people thought Hitler was quite a nice guy too didn't they to begin with ? Prison Planet - 9/11 Prior Knowledge Archive Alex Jones' Warning A CALL TO ACTION! Now of course you're totally wrong and misguided. But even if you are right and we are a bunch of "nutters" or "conspiracy theorists" then so are all these high profile people(that you rarely if ever hear mentioned on the TV news): And don't think "Well the TV says it isn't" because it is more lies and propaganda. Filmmaker Michael Moore Now Says 9/11 Could Be Inside Job Former MI5 Agent Says 9/11 An Inside Job Former German Minister Says Building 7 Used To Run 9/11 Attack Boston Air Traffic Controller Says 9/11 An Inside Job NY Fireman Lou Cacchioli Says 9/11 Comission Twisted His Words Charlie Sheen Says 9/11 Movement "Juggernaut Of Truth" Representative Of Largest 9/11 Families Group Says Government Complicit In Attack Former Head Of Star Wars Program Says Cheney Main 9/11 Suspect Charlie Sheen Says Media Complicit In 9/11 Cover-Up Prominent Physics Professor Refutes “Official” 9/11 Story I'll be delighted to hear your reply, but I suspect you won't have the guts to admit you might be wrong, despite the weight of evidence that no doubt you will convince yourself isn't worth even examining.... But on top of all this evidence do you seriously expect us to believe that a bunch of hijackers and at best amateur pilots overtook a domestic aircraft with boxcutters, managed to fly penetrate the most heavily fortified airspace in the world(domestic flights are routinely intercepted) do an almost impossible U turn and fly with absolute precision into the Twin Towers ? I MEAN COME ON ! If that's not a "conspiracy theory" I don't know what is.... And how did Building 7 collapse after not being hit by anything, and why did the BBC report it had fallen 20 minutes before it did with the building standing behind the reporter ? And most of the hijackers you believe carried it out, showed up alive and well after the attack ! With the massive amount of evidence staring you in the face, if you don't change your opinion, then I believe you personally don't deserve to see any change.. I'm afraid every one has got to swallow their pride, examine the massive amount of evidence and admit to being misled and lied to by government and the mainstream media. Unless of course you want to be a slave to the elite... P.S Davis Cameron/Tories/Labour won't do a thing for you.... I'm not trying to hack you off - I'M TRYING TO HELP YOU...... Ok I'm waiting for it to go all very quiet......