22ANDUK

Britain is pressing for the Security Council’s five permament members to be increased to include India, Japan, Germany and Brazil, plus an African country. Diplomats refused to say which, for fear of offending the chief contenders: South Africa and Nigeria, both regional powers, and Egypt, which is backed by Arab states. One possibility is a permanent African seat rotating between three or more countries.

Gordon Brown supports permanent seat for India on UN Security Council - Times Online

I think this is a generally positive move. The UN is no longer the same organisation that it was when it was formed by 50 states after the Second World War. I would certainly think a Council to include India (the world's largest democracy, 2nd largest country in terms of population and one of the fastest growing economy) should be encourage, I would also support moves for Japan (especially) and Brazil to have a seat to. I'm not too sure about Germany and what additional benefit they would bring, but do feel that Africa should have a place at the table - I feel that having a three/four way rotation for states could act as an incentive for others. Egypt for being an overall moderate Muslim country should be considered for rotation, whilst a country like Botswana for its democracy and prosperity would set a good example. Nigeria and South Africa would have to be considered to for rotation too I guess.

PolishUser

Germany should never be allowed to govern anything. Germany should never receive the right to anything.

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A vote for the Labour Party or the SNP is a vote for the Argentine police state.

Britannist

What utter nonsense "Polish User". Still jealous of the Germans aren't you?

Grow up.

Britannist

A thread on this subject already exists - it was opened by me just before 5.30 am this morning:

Gordon Brown's United Nations reform plan could reduce UK role on UN Security Council

Britannist

Germany is the largest economy in europe; the most populous nation in europe west of the Urals; the centre of the biggest language area of europe (over 120 million German-speakers); a leading member of NATO; a key particant in the group of 7/8 industrial nations and it has one of the most outstanding records in culture and technology.

Germany pays a substantial financial contribution to the United Nations (it always pays on time unlike many other member states of the United Nations) and it should have been given a permanent place on the United Nations Security Council decades ago.

Britannist

In other words you would let every significant country in the world have a permanent seat on the United Nations Security Council except one (yes readers - you've guessed it): Germany.

22ANDUK

On the contrary I'm a big Germano-phile (is that actually a word?).

I was on only asking what would be their special reason for having them on the Council (and you answered that in your early post, thanks Brit). As such, I'd be happy to have them, just arguing that it would be favourable to include a South American, prosperous African and/or moderate Islamic country over them.

I'd also like to have Germany on the Council as this would go a long way in negating calls for a single 'EU seat'. The Germans would certainly stop calling for one if it meant them losing their own individual seat and would also add weight to the argument that European countries would have more influence on the Council if three nation-states have three individual seats rather than all becoming one single one.

Westcountryman

Interested to know why they want Germany to have a seat. I would have thought they'd want to surrender ours and the French seat to the EU...

No objection to any of the Countries listed having a seat. The obvious candidate for Africa has surely got to be South Africa?

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Anyone who supports 42 days pre-charge detention should read this:

42-day detention: the threat to our liberty | John Major - Times Online

and this:

Why David Davis is right to make a stand | Mail Online

Britannist

It is now .

The word "Francophiles" and "Anglophiles" are in use - and now there is "Germanophile."

Britannist

I agree with this - good point 22&UK. Giving Germany her own permanent seat on the United Nations Security Council would make it much more difficult for the europhiles to get an EU seat on it and for the EU (once it got a permanent seat on the UN Security Council) to try to force the UK and France out of the permanent membership of the Security Council.

It also seems to me that since China, France and Russia have a permanent seat on the United Nations Security Council Germany should have one too - Germany's economy is bigger than that of any of those countries and its population is larger than that of France (and probably larger than that of the european part of Russia).