rjt

News | Africa - Reuters.com

Opposition critical of the brutal dicatators Slum Policy which has added to the misery of many of his people.

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Mr Delors said that he wanted the European Parliament to be the democratic body of the community, The Commission to be The Executive and The Council Of Ministers The Senate. NO! NO! NO!
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Ignore List: The Prophets of ST Al the Unelectable.

SilverFalcon

Mugabe can't last forever, even though he seems determined to. The good news is that neighbouring Zambia and Mozambique are starting to stir quietly as the South Africans get in there and help vamp up the tourist industry and look around the farming scene. China in close attendance. No one in this place ever says "die." We're going for broke and the Zambians and Mozambiquans are sick of starving and eager to get back into business. Wish us luck, rjt. Not all of us are going to live long enough to do something, but some will make it through the criminal violence and get economic help to these places and then the rollercoaster will start to move and perhaps the Southern tip of Africa can look forward to saying goodbye to decades of suffering and poverty. It's a gamble we all must take. And it's like the old pioneer days in many ways. These countries have completely collapsed in parts and need total rebuilding in all fields. Botswana is friendly too. Maybe something positive will come out of this in the end ...

mkpdavies

If the people of Zimbabwe are miserable, why don't they rise up and do something about it?

Are like Brits, apathetic spineless wusses?

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Aardvark

...or dead already.

The Zimbabweans I have encountered seem to be gentle and educated people. I suspect they still pin their hopes on democratic change. A revolution where one side has all the guns, all the food and a willingness to kill every single opponent and rape their wives and starve their children is not something entered into lightly - especially when the international community, that still ingratiates itself to Mugabe's regime, will stand by and do nothing. I wouldn't put it past Mbeki to go to Mugabe's aid - he could have sorted this mess years ago and has chosen not to.

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"I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008

SilverFalcon

No, they are most certainly not spineless. The people of Zimbabwe are in continuous revolt against the regime. But they are breathtakingly poor now and have a violent police state that will literally beat any opposition to death in the streets. You must have seen what happened to their opposition leader a short while ago when he tried to attend a rally for his party. They nearly killed him.

The journalists are in open revolt and are regularly threatened and arrested. Some two million Zimbabweans (at least) are living in South Africa so they can try and send money home to desperate wives and family. Even the criminals come over here because the pickings in Zim are slim.

But the patriotism of the people is very strong and they are willing and ready to return if they get the chance to do something concrete to change the situation. Their problem is that they have fallen so far below the bread line they have to worry constantly about empty shops, empty petrol stations and empty stomachs. I feel they will rise at some stage. When all hope is gone, and that time is almost upon them, they may throw caution to the wind and take to the streets. But they will be viciously cut down if they do. And the fate of children and family if this happens tends to keep them from boiling over. South Africa should have done something long ago but its leader is in debt to Mugabe from the old revolutionary days.

mkpdavies

I guess we should all learn a lesson here.

Never let the government tell you that you can't have guns.

DOH!

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SilverFalcon

It's better by far never to allow things to go that far. To kill is difficult the first time around but once someone has done it and survived, the second and third time are a breeze. I remember how my father told me that the war made the soldiers callous. The Zimbabweans had little choice, of course, as they were pushed into their dilemma by Britain trying to shake them off without thinking about who they were putting into power.

The right to bear arms is a thorny issue as it is not the gun savvy responsible citizen who goes on the rampage. As you can see by what is happening in American schools and now spreading to places like Finland, there must be tight control over how many weapons people are allowed to have and the nature of the weapon, etc. Otherwise people start collecting military hardware. Where I am even a 9mm tends to look like a pop gun against an AK47. All the criminals have illegal AKs now. Like parts of Britain

mkpdavies

If you outlaw guns, only the outlaws have guns.

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Aardvark

Indeed, Matt, and that's why the authorities reckon there are more firearms in circulation in the UK than there ever were when people had the right to legally acquire arms.

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When in Woking do as the Wokes do.

"I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008

pentameter

SA? When I was there about 15 years ago there had been a big influx from the droughts and the wars to the north and the newcomers brought their AK47s with them. I heard AK47s changed hands in the townships for about £5 - R50 at the time.