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Old 19-05-2008, 07:42 PM   #71 (permalink)
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My main opposition to Islam is that it like Communism is against the nation-state and nationalism.

Nationalism is a concept alien to Islam because it calls for unity based on
family and tribalistic ties, whereas Islam binds people together on the
`Aqeedah, that is belief in Allah (swt) and His Messenger (saaw). Islam
calls for the ideological bond.
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Old 19-05-2008, 10:47 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Nobody has said that if he existed, then everything said about him in the Bible is necessarily true. So no-one is 'missing the point' (except for you perhaps).
I didn't say they had...

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No, it's not irrelevant: if he didn't exist, then Christianity is false. If he did exist, it might be true or it might be false. Now, have you anything relevant to add?
Accepted. I didn't think of this at the time. What I was really thinking about, which I did not make clear at the time, was the existence of God - which I see as far more important to any discussion concerning a religion which believes in a deity.

P.S. For_England, perhaps next time your reply could be a little more civil - you seem to be extremely angry for some reason and I would appreciate it if next time you were not so aggressive in your posts towards me.
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Old 19-05-2008, 10:50 PM   #73 (permalink)
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I suppose he was too well versed in history to bother with such a silly notion.
Although entirely irrelevant to the point he or I was making. The fact that he missed it out means he falls foul of a logical fallacy. The fact that I mentioned it was that myth can mean many things (for example, whether Jesus did or did not exist or whether Jesus did exist and the miracles he supposedly performed did or did not).
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Old 19-05-2008, 10:56 PM   #74 (permalink)
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My main opposition to Islam is that it like Communism is against the nation-state and nationalism.

Nationalism is a concept alien to Islam because it calls for unity based on
family and tribalistic ties, whereas Islam binds people together on the
`Aqeedah, that is belief in Allah (swt) and His Messenger (saaw). Islam
calls for the ideological bond.
Can't nationalism also be founded upon an ideological bond? I would have though so.
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Old 20-05-2008, 06:57 AM   #75 (permalink)
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And you consider that inviting a man to strike you on the other cheek after he has struck you on the first one is a basis for what is best for people?
Yes.

It sends an immediate message to the attacker that he is dealing with a thing that is bigger than both of them. For the victim it allows him to “witness for his faith”.

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But surely if a Christian were to take Jesus` alleged example seriously we would be seeing far more martyrs today? I wonder where they have all gone?
In part the people who would have turned them into martyrs have realised that Christianity is not the threat that they themselves are, in part because many people realise that in dealing with a true Christian they are dealing with someone who is essentially a good and decent person which true Christians, in my experience are, and remember, Idiscriminate between church goers and Christians. The two are not automatically the same..

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I am not here to defend islam and no[before someone asks the ridiculous question] I am NOT David Myatt!
As far as I am concerned they are both alien semitic ideologies that have no place in Europe.
Since European culture is based on Christian ethics and morality it would seem that claiming that Christianity has no place in Europe simply shows great ignorance about Europe.

As for Islam being a Semitic ideology, I would only agree insofar as Islam was probably invented by a man who was of that race. I do agree that it has no place in Europe and precisely because our superior culture is Christian based.

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“As for following his teachings leading to, as you so quaintly put it, to “the exaltation of the ultimate in human failure”, what a strange and single dimension (not to mention ludicrous) thought!”

You really ought to study the New Testament! Here is a sample for you to enjoy which proves my point exactly!

1Cr 1:26For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, [are called]:

1Cr 1:27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

1Cr 1:28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, [yea], and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
Shot yourself in the foot there.
The Scripture you quote is from Paul’s letters to the Corinthians, it is part of the Western Bible (I note you use the KJV) but is not part the teaching of Jesus.

It also shows that you have missed the message that Paul was sending.

Try looking at this site to help you in your quest for the truth as seen by Christians.

Matthew Henry's Commentary on the Whole Bible [Volume Index] | Christian Classics Ethereal Library

Unless of course you’re scared that you might, on seeing the truth, see the light and convert!

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(Then) that means that the standards of Christianity are unattainable and thus foolish and of no relevant application to real life.
Of course the standards of Christianity are unattainable!

But that doesn’t mean that a Christian person shouldn’t know what they are and shouldn’t strive towards them!

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“I suspect that you are very young. “

Many people say that I don`t look my 47 years.
I would add, no, on second thoughts better not. It would only result in a formal complaint!
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Old 20-05-2008, 04:59 PM   #76 (permalink)
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P.S. For_England, perhaps next time your reply could be a little more civil - you seem to be extremely angry for some reason and I would appreciate it if next time you were not so aggressive in your posts towards me.
Accepted. Sorry.
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Old 20-05-2008, 05:41 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Bear, "...I would only agree insofar as Islam was probably invented by a man who was of that race. I do agree that it has no place in Europe and precisely because our superior culture is Christian based."

So no place in South America, or USA, or Africa for this superior culture.
Superior culture? I await expectantly.
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Old 21-05-2008, 05:41 PM   #78 (permalink)
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So,Imperium,can you say what you think of the Religion of islam and then how you interpret the cruel and evil parts of the so called holy book,the koran?
I have never read the koran, have you? And I don`t mean snippets from the Internet! Have you read it in its entirety?

Have you ever read the bible in its entirety? I have, many times! And I can think of nothing more disgusting, cruel and `evil` than the contents of that book, especially the parts that deal with the jews` destruction and slaughter of their enemies, men, women, children and even animals at the behest of their bloodthirsty misanthropic `god`!
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Old 21-05-2008, 05:47 PM   #79 (permalink)
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[quote=C_steam;502635]
Quote:
But you see, it is insulting to some, as you no doubt realise in your continued usage and the fact you are proud to quote others arguing against you for using such 'short hand'.
A genuine xtian would never be offended by so trivial a matter.

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As for the existence or otherwise of Christ, whilst 'contempory' evidence is lacking, many of the events of the gospels have been cross referenced to known events. The historian Josephus whilst not exactly contempory (in so far as can be established) is close enough to wonder why such a historian would mention Christ if he was a fable.
Josephus Flavius, the Jewish historian, lived as the earliest non-Christian who mentions a Jesus. Although many scholars think that Josephus' short accounts of Jesus (in Antiquities) came from interpolations perpetrated by a later Church father (most likely, Eusebius), Josephus' birth in 37 C.E., well after the alleged crucifixion of Jesus, puts him out of range of an eyewitness account. Moreover, he wrote Antiquities in 93 C.E., after the first gospels got written! Therefore, even if his accounts about Jesus came from his hand, his information could only serve as hearsay.



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But it wouldn't matter to Christians anyway, as Christianity is a faith based religion and faith does not require fact.
It is allegedly based on the historicity of the birth, life and manner of death of its central figure, jesus of nazareth. People have been burned at the stake for calling these alleged `facts` into question along with other less trivial matters of faith.
If jesus did not exist he was thus not the son of `god` or the supposed saviour of mankind who `died for our sins`.
Without any historical evidence it is a mere collection of jewish fairtytales and thus of no relevance to European man living in the 21st century.
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Old 21-05-2008, 05:49 PM   #80 (permalink)
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My main opposition to Islam is that it like Communism is against the nation-state and nationalism.

Nationalism is a concept alien to Islam because it calls for unity based on
family and tribalistic ties, whereas Islam binds people together on the
`Aqeedah, that is belief in Allah (swt) and His Messenger (saaw). Islam
calls for the ideological bond.
xtianity is no less opposed to the nation-state and nationalism for it places no distinction between `jew and Greek`.
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