BonnieDundee

I have English blood, my mother is Cornish and I'm not a Scots nationalist. I oppose England having a say in this as I oppose the people of Edinburgh voting in the London mayoral elections or the Germans having a say on the running of the UK.
Because it doesn't directly effect them. Whether or not Scotland becomes independent is not the business of the English to prevent. If the English want independence that is different.


Your arguments are absurd. Whether the Scots want independence is their own business, it does not effect England directly.


Yes. Because Scotland's independence is her business.

Should the rest of the EU get to vote in referendums about whether the UK leaves the EU?

Now what the English want to do, ie whether they want independence is a different matter and they can vote on that.

You are a moron. It is obviously not directly their business.

__________________
"It is poor civic hygiene to install technologies that could someday facilitate a police state."
-Bruce Schneier

How to Overthrow the System: brew your own beer; kick in your TV; build your own cabin and p*ss off front porch whenever you bloody well feel like it.
Edward Abbey

Leopold Kohr.

Britannist

cassie

You're the one, in writing about blood lines, who takes the racialist approach! In my opinion, you have a Scottish outlook which seeks to deny England a say [note a 'SAY'!] in anything! Your attempts to justify this attitude are whimsical and irrelevant. How silly to compare two cities in debates about the position of two nations, but that's what Scots do! The only common factor is population ratios - England:Scotland=51:5millions - London:Edinburgh=6:0.45!

I observe that you have to qualify your denial with the word 'directly'. Yeah, I suppose (for example) the location of the British [ie English Army] and other elements of the Armed Forces wouldn't directly affect us would it? Neither would the re-location of the Trident nuclear facility from Faslane. Nor would the changes in government revenue expenditure on items such as the funding of Scotland's devolved assembly or the Barnett formula affect us, not to mention tax revenue income from Scotch, would it? Do I really have to go on?


I think I've made a case above; all you can do is deny rational argument without dealing with any of my points. Your childish flat denials are more appropriate to pantos!


I think I've made a case above; all you can do is deny rational argument without dealing with any of my points.

This question and its irrelevance are utterly absurd, and merely serve to demonstrate the inadequacy of your intellect. I'll keep my answer short and to the point: No, the "rest of the EU" is not part of the UK.

That's so big of you!


Bereft of any reasonable or rational argument you resort to insults. You will appreciate that, your unfounded opinions being very important to me, I'm so wounded!



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Smidgey

Thanks for answering my question Cassie . Every discussion I ever get into with you has one of these two outcomes:

You never answering questions

or

You complaining at me because of where I happened to have been born.

BonnieDundee should do what I started doing a few weeks ago; ignoring the vast majority of your posts since it is usually nonsense about something that wouldn't even phase a person who didn't have your obsession (c.f. the Northern Irish 'rights' thing that you posted).

__________________
How vain is man, who boasts in fight the valour of gigantic might!

-Georg Friedrich Händel

cassie

You specialise in generalisations. I am not aware of any question relevant to this thread which you have posed to me. Perhaps you'd care to remind me?

While you're about it, perhaps you'd also care to cite the actual words you allege I used [and the Post] to 'complain' about you because of your country of birth? True, I oppose your opinions by reason of your Scottishness, but that is not 'complaining'. Kindly do not try to use my language against me!

I note you overlook BonnieDundee's dictatorial opinions that the English should not be permitted to record collective opinions about Scotland's continued presence or otherwise in the UK! Bit of the old double standards here.

Again, I am not 'obsessed' as you allege without evidence. However, I firmly oppose the third class treatment of the English especially when compared with the preferential treatment accorded the Scots, the Welsh and the Northern Irish! Typically, you misrepresent my position.

In the circumstances, especially against the background of this last bilious spew of yours, it would be an improvement for you to refrain from making your inadequate comments in reaction to my posts.


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BonnieDundee

I fully support an English parliament which has almost full powers over England.

But those are not your business. If you wish to change them you can ask the people of England, but on what the Scot's wish to do you cannot comment as everyone else in this thread and most people seem to agree as common sense.

You have made no case.



And England is not part of Scotland. If they want to vote on the union that is there choice but they don't get to vote on what the Scot's want.

You are moron.

Your position is absurd, it was called so at the beginning of this thread before you mentioned it and your name was brought up as the only moron who seems to support such lunacy. You seem unable to differentiate between the Scottish and English people voting on their opinions of the union and how they are different matters which neither should intervene in the other.

__________________
"It is poor civic hygiene to install technologies that could someday facilitate a police state."
-Bruce Schneier

How to Overthrow the System: brew your own beer; kick in your TV; build your own cabin and p*ss off front porch whenever you bloody well feel like it.
Edward Abbey

Leopold Kohr.

BonnieDundee

You are a moron and a liar it seems. I fully support the English doing that. But the place to do that is different to the place with which the Scot's decide their views. As every other single contributor to this thread on this topic seems to realise.

I already do, the guy isn't worth it.

__________________
"It is poor civic hygiene to install technologies that could someday facilitate a police state."
-Bruce Schneier

How to Overthrow the System: brew your own beer; kick in your TV; build your own cabin and p*ss off front porch whenever you bloody well feel like it.
Edward Abbey

Leopold Kohr.

Ea of Dune

I think the whole argument over this comes from where your political opinions are hedged.

If for example you are a Unionist who opposes devolution your argument is certainly going to be the UK is one nation and thus all parts should have a say over a single part seperating.

If you are a federalist your argument could be that all nations within the UK should have seperate legislature and either:
1.) They can vote for seperation .. or
2.) for a single part of the federation to leave all parts most vote in favour.

If you are a Nationalist you could argue that each country should have a right to have its say without the input of the other nations.

A regionalist could argue that a the UK should be split down into smaller local administrative areas, but once again the argument becomes should the whole UK have a say on the seperation or should the region.

My personal opinion on the situation is this...

Before ANY vote is made on Scottish independence England should be given a full working parliament. Wales and the NI assemblies should be upgraded to an equal footing. Once we are all on the same level, should a nation wish to leave the Union/Federation or whatever they wish to call it then a referendum should be held in that federal country.

In my opinion arguments over Rockall, Shetland, Cornwall and Orkney can then be sorted after the above as this would make more sense.

Ea of dune

BonnieDundee

I'm a unionist. But it makes no sense to me that England should vote on what the Scot's want.

They can vote on what they want of course and should.

And so should Cornwall.

__________________
"It is poor civic hygiene to install technologies that could someday facilitate a police state."
-Bruce Schneier

How to Overthrow the System: brew your own beer; kick in your TV; build your own cabin and p*ss off front porch whenever you bloody well feel like it.
Edward Abbey

Leopold Kohr.

Ea of Dune

BD> As I said though above, there are so many flavours if Uninoism/Nationalism etc. I presume you see England, Cornwall, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland as seperate countries (even if not recognised by our current government in the case of Cornwall) ?

Ea of dune