Greek workers lead by example
Greek hospital workers are showing what workers across the world should be doing when faced with closures. Good luck to them
Greek hospital now under workers' control | libcom.org
How are they going to pay for it? Oh that's right, they are going to get their bankrupt government to keep funding it. What really do people in Greece expect? With years and years and years of not paying taxes (or rather not collecting them), with huge outgoings, it is inevitable that the money run out. No government wants to cut services, and no worker wants to accept them. BUT THE PIGGY BANK IS EMPTY. These workers who want to get their wages back to how they were, where do they think the money is going to come from? There is NO MONEY available. As is typical, you hear (quite naturally) the self interests of people, but no solution to the problem. As long as they are not affected they don't really care.
I fully support angelman's points.
It all sounds impressive, but they have already cancelled all health care except for emergencies. I assume that the management have been sent home and there is virtually no administration. There are no clues as to how many doctors and nurses remain nor how, since all decisions are going to be made at an assembly in a few days time, shifts are rostered. No doubt the workers will vote on cleaning up the vomit and blood and sorting out the drainage, but I wouldn't count on it. They seem committed to telling everyone what they are doing, but I suspect there is no commitment to doing any of it.
If the workers are in control and haven't been paid, how long will they last? I hope they have a lot of food, water, loo roll and all the requisites of day to day survival since, unless they are about to nick the stuff their supplies will run out pretty quickly. The ambulances need petrol, the operating theatres need electricity, blood stocks have to be replenished, bandages, dressings, drugs etc all cost somebody some money and, since Greece is about to spear in big time, if the hospital hasn't got enough they will run out pretty soon (as will the whole country once they stop paying the bills).
Workers' control hasn't worked in history and I doubt it will work now. The Soviet and Chinese communists caused the deaths of millions of peasants when they tried to run everything themselves. In the end they had to create command economies that were less efficient at providing products and services than any other system previously known to man.
Greece has no money, they are fast running out of cash for daily necessities and if the rest of the Eurozone doesn't cough up then it's game over. Do the workers really believe they can convince the capitalist world to magic up funds for their barmy projects? Why would I give a cent to the people who've seized their hospital? Who will?
Originally Posted by angelman
angelman: Too simplistic, I fear. The best assistance for Greece would be to leave or get expelled from the Eurozone. That would cause havoc to
many banks in many countries, but that is unfortunate. Until that happens, Greece is still a member of a eurozone, and the resources of THAT zone must be available to them all. That is the reality of having a common currency, whether it be the euro, American dollar, or the UK sterling. It must circulate unimpeded throughout the whole geographical area. Greece may have had an unfortunate economic history, but Spain, by contrast, was in surplus and had a low national debt as a percentage of the GDP, until she joined the euro. Do they also get thrown to the wolves? The euro has failed, and those who created the eurozone have a compelling obligation to mitigate the harm that they have caused. Destabilise the global economy, and political instability will soon follow. The rise of dictatorships in the inter-war years cannot be separated from the financial chaos of those times. What is the solution to a global financial system which is collapsing before our eyes? I doubt if there is just one solution, but all the indications are that we have come to the end of a very successful financial and economic epoch. I am certain, however, that we all would be wise to resist transforming every discourse about economics into one on moral philosophy.
Western Europe needs about fifty million jobs to return to full employment. What are they to be? An additional problem is that the major portion of productivity is provided by highly capitalised, but low labour processes. I cannot think of an exception to that rule: whether it be agriculture, retailing, processing, and the greater part of manufacturing. The labour intensive parts, again whether in agriculture, retailing etc, are the least productive, and are often government financed; hill farming, crofting, etc. We are virtually in a post-industrial society (in employment terms), while what is produced requires only consumers to make it profitable. The processes and means by which those customers acquire that purchasing power is, I believe, the central economic problem of our time. Perhaps you don't believe a word of it, but I am quite certain that what I say is close to the truth.
Understand they cant win if isolated. But if workers take over the means of production it can work. They are setting the example for others to follow. Stalinism and maoism failed Russia and china not democratic socialism. the first 6 years of the revolution under Lenin saw a backward country transformed into a world leader. capitalists choose to ignore that fact and that capitalism has brought starvation and homelessness
[QUOTE=Geoffrey Collier;1322622]angelman: Too simplistic, I fear. The best assistance for Greece would be to leave or get expelled from the Eurozone. That would cause havoc to
many banks in many countries, but that is unfortunate. Until that happens, Greece is still a member of a eurozone, and the resources of THAT zone must be available to them all. That is the reality of having a common currency, whether it be the euro, American dollar, or the UK sterling. It must circulate unimpeded throughout the whole geographical area. Greece may have had an unfortunate economic history, but Spain, by contrast, was in surplus and had a low national debt as a percentage of the GDP, until she joined the euro. Do they also get thrown to the wolves? The euro has failed, and those who created the eurozone have a compelling obligation to mitigate the harm that they have caused. Destabilise the global economy, and political instability will soon follow. The rise of dictatorships in the inter-war years cannot be separated from the financial chaos of those times. What is the solution to a global financial system which is collapsing before our eyes? I doubt if there is just one solution, but all the indications are that we have come to the end of a very successful financial and economic epoch. I am certain, however, that we all would be wise to resist transforming every discourse about economics into one on moral philosophy.
Western Europe needs about fifty million jobs to return to full employment. What are they to be? An additional problem is that the major portion of productivity is provided by highly capitalised, but low labour processes. I cannot think of an exception to that rule: whether it be agriculture, retailing, processing, and the greater part of manufacturing. The labour intensive parts, again whether in agriculture, retailing etc, are the least productive, and are often government financed; hill farming, crofting, etc. We are virtually in a post-industrial society (in employment terms), while what is produced requires only consumers to make it profitable. The processes and means by which those customers acquire that purchasing power is, I believe, the central economic problem of our time. Perhaps you don't believe a word of it, but I am quite certain that what I say is close to the truth.[/QUOTE
Geoffrey,
This is 100 percent right, while the powers that be play one section of our society off against an other the world is changing. People just don't seem to grasp the magnitude of the events that are now unfolding.
Last edited by Appian; 07-02-2012 at 09:51 PM.
'But where danger is deliverance also grows.'
Is it not time to put a package together for Greece to return to its own currency?
Give them a chance to go alone, they tried it, it didn't work, don't prolong the agony, give them their monetary freedom to get back on track.
Let Greece be the first workers state
Struggle Solidarity Socialism
It could well work in their favour, if you are working for your own country, it gives you a better feeling of self achievement thatn being placed in the position of a stranglehold, that this is what you have to do.
No offence to anyone, but the EU has given itself more a feeling of a debt collecting agency than a Union for all, that is another reason that Greece would do better if they were given a package to return back to it's own currency.
.From the 6th February, hospital workers will only deal with emergencies until their wages, and monies owed have been paid. They are also demanding a return to wage levels prior to the implementation of austerity measures
No need to think then.
Cloud cookoo land ecconomics don't work.
The idea that Russian transformed under Lennin is wrong. Russia had a 7% growth rate for a decade or more before the first world war. After it managed 5% only once Stalin had made it a slave labour state. One of the principal reasons the Germans went to war was that they thought that they had their best chance of winning at that point due to the emergance of Russia as a "Tiger ecconomy". They, in their militeristic mind set, could not concieve of a "not having a war" idea. Militarists for you.
I've finally got a web site to work!! See my page thingy.
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