Climate change sceptics lose vital argument

David Holland · 07-12-2006, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Carter

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Holland

As the UK will soon be a net importer of oil and gas and most oil and gas states are hostile to the west. You could argue that it does not matter if the greenhouse effect is real or not - we still need to find alternative fuels that don't provide money to terrorists and Chavez etc.

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

Is that net (after the fuel costs etc) or gross (before the fuel used to harvest).

SGK · 07-12-2006, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Besoeker

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Carter

Quote:

Originally Posted by Besoeker

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Carter

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

How?

Go look it up. The truth is out there.

Your claim.
Put up or shut up.

I find this astonishing coming from Besoeker who, on a previous thread, repeatedly refused to back up his claims.

Besoeker knows best thread

John Carter · 07-12-2006, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Holland

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Carter

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Holland

As the UK will soon be a net importer of oil and gas and most oil and gas states are hostile to the west. You could argue that it does not matter if the greenhouse effect is real or not - we still need to find alternative fuels that don't provide money to terrorists and Chavez etc.

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

Is that net (after the fuel costs etc) or gross (before the fuel used to harvest).

That's net.

John Carter · 07-12-2006, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Besoeker

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Carter

Quote:

Originally Posted by Besoeker

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Carter

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

How?

Go look it up. The truth is out there.

Your claim.
Put up or shut up.

It's real easy. You're on the Internet. Go to www.google.com and look up:

1) The recommended space for keeping a cow.
2) High yield biodiesel production.

Can you do that? Do you have the brain power? Or are you and Clippo telling me that you can't actually find out any information about anything unless some scientist leaves a peer-reviewed paper next to your dunny?

C_steam · 07-12-2006, 08:57 AM

Quote:

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

Doesn't sound too far fetched.

1.5 acres = .6 hectare so 1 hectare will produce 100,000 litres.

1 hectare = 10,000 square metres so 1 square metre produces 10 litres.

Assume big plants spaced at 15cm intervals, say 45 plants per square metre. So each plant, assuming only 1 crop per year, needs to produce 230ml - somewhere around a third of a pint.

(someone check the maths!)

SGK · 07-12-2006, 09:06 AM

Far too much metric, C_steam. Shame on you. :wink:

Hartlepool · 07-12-2006, 09:07 AM

I hear spacing of 9cm is used in this area at the moment.(last season.)

John Carter · 07-12-2006, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C_steam

Quote:

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

Doesn't sound too far fetched.

1.5 acres = .6 hectare so 1 hectare will produce 100,000 litres.

1 hectare = 10,000 square metres so 1 square metre produces 10 litres.

Assume big plants spaced at 15cm intervals, say 45 plants per square metre. So each plant, assuming only 1 crop per year, needs to produce 230ml - somewhere around a third of a pint.

(someone check the maths!)

Algae is where it's at.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biodiesel#Production

Besoeker · 07-12-2006, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SGK

I find this astonishing coming from Besoeker who, on a previous thread, repeatedly refused to back up his claims.

Quite the reverse. You refuted my point but were unable to give any sound basis for doing so.

Besoeker · 07-12-2006, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C_steam

Quote:

1.5 acres will support one cow or the production of about 60,000 litres of biodiesel.

Doesn't sound too far fetched.

1.5 acres = .6 hectare so 1 hectare will produce 100,000 litres.

1 hectare = 10,000 square metres so 1 square metre produces 10 litres.

Assume big plants spaced at 15cm intervals, say 45 plants per square metre. So each plant, assuming only 1 crop per year, needs to produce 230ml - somewhere around a third of a pint.

(someone check the maths!)

Your arithmetic seems fine to me.

But this article suggests that 60,000 litres per acre is a bit of a stretch.

Quote:

High yield
There are two key indicators in evaluating crops for biofuel production: the fuel yield per acre and the net energy yield of the biofuels, after
subtracting the energy used in both production and refining. For ethanol, the top yields per acre are 714 gallons from sugar beets in France and 662 gallons per acre for sugarcane in Brazil. U.S. corn comes in at 354 gallons per acre, or roughly half the beet and cane yields.

http://www.peopleandplanet.net/doc.php?id=2573

714 US gallons is about 2,700 Litres.

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07-12-2006, 09:06 AM	#26 (permalink)
SGK Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,237	Far too much metric, C_steam. Shame on you. :wink:

07-12-2006, 09:07 AM	#27 (permalink)
Hartlepool Uber Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: North East England Posts: 6,413	I hear spacing of 9cm is used in this area at the moment.(last season.)