steve fowler

AV system?.

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RULE BRITANNIA BRITANNIA RULES THE WAVES, BRITONS NEVER EVER SHALL BE SLAVE'S.

Never give in - never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.
Winston Churchill.

When Labour won the 1997 General Election, Enoch Powell told his wife that the electorate had voted to break up the United Kingdom.

Populist Lee

>> Alternative Vote <<

Electoral Reform Society

A version is used currently for the London Mayoral Vote.

Populist Lee

Apparently, it is a very good system for "keeping extremist parties out".

I presume they're thinking UKIP as well as someone else!

mattyr2k8

who is whoever wrote that article, to label opposition political parties as "extremist parties"?

Populist Lee

The mindset of these people is very illuminating.

For many years now I have been very suspicious of the likes of the Electoral Reform Society.

mattyr2k8

i wonder how exactly they define "extremist party", and if they can explain why they consider liblabcon the "none-extremist" parties and everyone else "extremist parties".

Populist Lee

Putting it crudely it will be anyone who does not subscribe to the *Consensus*.
If you bear in mind that this consensus includes support for the EU, the explanation for UKIP's ostracism becomes clear.

The mindset using these parameters goes well beyond what most ordinary people would define as being "extremist".

Britannist

AV is not proportional and the pro-proportional representation (PR) europhile Liberal 'Democrats' are not likely to be happy with it.

In theory AV opens up the possibility for UKIP to win in some constituencies. The AV voting system was used in France for national elections until small parties started winning seats in Parliament. When that happened President Mitterrand very quickly changed the system back to what we have here (First-Past-The-Post - FPTP).

Had AV been used at the last UK General Election it would have given the Labour Party an even bigger majority than the one they actually secured on 36% of the vote under FPTP.

While some in the Labour and Liberal 'Democrat' (Lib Dims) parties might think AV would give them semi-permanent power in a UK Government coalition research has shown that AV over-rewards the party with the greatest amount of support - but heavily penalises that party (and its coalition partners) when it/they becomes unpopular.

Just as Labour and the Lib Dims wrongly thought they could hold power permanently in the Scottish Parliament (they lost power in the Scottish Parliament in May 2007 after eight years of being in charge) those two parties would be wrong in assuming that AV will put them into Government and keep them there in perpetuity. It would not - they could be half-obliterated at a General Election held using AV voting when they became unpopular at the same time.

Very small changes in voting patterns in Australia - where AV is used - has resulted in Governments being defeated heavily.

For those who do not know how AV works - here is a quick guide: instead of people placing a cross by the name of the candidate they want to win on the ballot paper the voter puts the numeral 1 by the name of the candidate he wants to win and the numeral 2 by the name of the candidate who s/he would like to win if his first choice were not to be elected (and then by the voter placing 3 by the name of their third preference and so on). If no candidate in the constituency gets over 50% of the vote the second and third preference votes are distributed the various candidates and the person with the most first, second and third preference votes wins (if their were four candidates fourth preference votes would be included and if there were five candidates in the constituency voters would be entitled to express a fifth preference on the ballot paper if they wished to do so).

kernow

Because the establishment want to be able to keep them all in their pocket, and you can't do that with loose canons like UKIP about, so best to stop them preaching freedom from the black hole money pit of the EU and ban them and their ilk!

Westcountryman

Why not just a pure PR system? Only problem I can see is that it would break the constituency link.

What about the Additional Member System?

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Porthemmet Beach