Why Libertarianism is wrong

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by British-Conservatism

5) Socialism should be illegal, unconstitutional. It is a blatant violation of rights. In any case, all of your scenarios have come with a socialist fix; you are the socialist threat, not foreigners!

Not very Libertarian of you.
I have always thought Libertarianism and Democracy are incompatible the only way a Libertarian society could survive is through a dictatorship.

Democracy isn't exactly a great system.

Although benign dictatorship would be best, it will never happen. Limited democracy is what I would opt for to try to achieve maximum liberty.

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by British-Conservatism

My Conservatism is the Conservatism of Disraeli, Chamberlain, Baldwin and Bonar Law.
Real Conservatism not the Libertarianism of Thatcher or the Liberalism of Cameron.

Thatcher wasn't a libertarian.

British-Conservatism · 13-04-2008, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Bear

May I just point out that we are now in the twenty first century and what may have been good for that load of shysters in their day most certainly isn't good for todays world.

On the contrary Traditional Conservatism is now needed more today then ever before.
It is the direct antidote to the problems of immigration, crime and break down of discipline and order in society we face today.

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tito

Also, as you will note from my signature, I am an Objectivist, not a Libertarian. If you are truly a Conservative we will have much common ground.

Tito, do you accept all objectivism or just the political aspects?

As much as I enjoy Rand and support much of what she says, my three main problems with her are her denial of altruism, which runs contrary to much of modern moral psychology, and her philosophy of aesthetics which cannot account for non-artificial aesthetic beauty, such as natural beauty - specifically the sublime, which many hold to be the highest aesthetic pleasure. Finally, her disagreement with Kant (and Schopenhauer) about phenomena and noumena I think is extremely naive.

I tend to be like Nozick concerning Rand: I like some of the conclusions, not so much the way she got there.

British-Conservatism · 13-04-2008, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smidgey

Thatcher wasn't a libertarian.

She described herself as a Liberal in the Classical sense so its as close as you will get.

British-Conservatism · 13-04-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smidgey

Democracy isn't exactly a great system.

Although benign dictatorship would be best, it will never happen. Limited democracy is what I would opt for to try to achieve maximum liberty.

Democracy is a great system im very confident is a system of true democracy that the naturally Conservative people of England would come to the correct conclusions and demand Conservative reforms.

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by British-Conservatism

On the contrary Traditional Conservatism is now needed more today then ever before.
It is the direct antidote to the problems of immigration, crime and break down of discipline and order in society we face today.

Libertarians can be tough on crime too.

Furthermore, most would agree with you concerning immigration. It just cannot be supported under the current system. However, ultimately I would say that the socialist welfare state is the main problem.

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by British-Conservatism

She described herself as a Liberal in the Classical sense so its as close as you will get.

And Hitler called himself a Christian...

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by British-Conservatism

Democracy is a great system im very confident is a system of true democracy that the naturally Conservative people of England would come to the correct conclusions and demand Conservative reforms.

Democracy is just the rule of the majority, rather than a single tyrant you have many.

As for the political system changing, I think that is naive. I would consider the USA to be more politically conservative than the UK - they still have a burgeoning welfare state and large social problems.

Smidgey · 13-04-2008, 10:43 AM

I'll reply to your large post soon, but I'm going out for a while first.

Interesting post though! I'm sure we will get a good discussion going.

13-04-2008, 10:43 AM	#20 (permalink)
Smidgey Uber Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 2,129 Party: Libertarian Party	I'll reply to your large post soon, but I'm going out for a while first. Interesting post though! I'm sure we will get a good discussion going. __________________ How vain is man, who boasts in fight the valour of gigantic might! -Georg Friedrich Händel

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