Robert Edwards

In response to Vortex (200)

[quote]<<That is what Nick Griffin has done and the reason why he leads the most succcessful British Nationalist party in British history. The vast majority of members have joined the party since the modernising wing gained control from the Tyndallites whose methods and views had proved unsuccessfull and impractical. We are also committed to democracy, and have rejected the type of political activities such as marches and rowdy public meetings that have usually ended in disorder, admittedly as a result of violent attacks by left wing extremists.>>[quote]

How is the BNP successful when it does not have a single MP in Parliament? You have a small number of local councillors, many of whom have resigned or dropped out, out of several hundreds in local authorities. You could lose the lot and be back to square one. Marches and meetings were good propaganda events and people could actually see how natrionalists behaved in public. Now you have closed meetings that exclude the public and most of the media. Some of these meetings are booked under bogus names. What kind of impression is that?

[quote]<<Did the BUF or UM ever achieve a single elected representative let alone form the opposition group on a large London council? Did it ever achieve 800,000 votes and 5% of the votes in a national election?>>[quote]

In the 1937 LCC elections, British Union candidates achieved 23 per cent of the vote in East London. This was at a time when only householders had the vote. A Mr Symington of Market Harborough was a councillor supporting Mosley in the 1930s. In the mid-1950s a Union Movement candidate achieved 33 percent of the vote in a straight fight with Labour in the Moorfields ward in Shoreditch.
British Union elected councillors included C.H. Bentink-Budd in Worthing. A UM elected councillor was a Mr Price-Hayward.

[quote]<<The BNP is a long way off achieving real political power and we all know that, but as I have said it is the only viable vehicle in which that necessary change can be invoked.>>[quote]

The present government is making an issue of immigration at the moment, tightening up the rules for entry. This will deal a serious blow to the anti-immigration BNP. You still have UKIP as a far from dead competitor.

[quote]<<Fascism is forever tainted by the atrocities and images from the Second World War, and Mosley despite his great intellect and brilliant oratory was always tarnished by his association with it. His unique and radical post war ideas on Europe A Nation are far removed from the monstrosity of the modern EU, but as you have opined the past always came back to haunt him.>>[quote]

Fascism is a phenomenon of the 1930s. After the war, Mosley went beyond fascism and the old style democracy. Europe a Nation is the great synthesis that reconciles the drawbacks of fascism and the faults in the old style of party politics. We are not fascists - we are post-fascist - and we are National Europeans. Go to Home Page
Fascism next time is a slogan from the 1930s. Remember that war-time atrocities had not occurred at that time and the whole business of the Holocaust had never entered the nation's mindset.
The crimes of communism were far greater and what goes on in Iraq and Palestine today counts as war crime. So, you see, fascism never had the monopoly on man's inhumanity to man.

Hunter

The success of the BNP does not necessarily depend upon the number of those elected to office. Given the amount of media and political enmity shown towards the BNP, it is notable that we have any success at all. As for the 'secrecy' you mention, perhaps if any meeting your Party held was interrupted by thugs, or the owner of the property where the meeting was held received death threats, you would consider not advertising it. If you find this difficult to believe why not go along to one of your local BNP meetings and ask them if this is true or not. Or perhaps you prefer to believe that the lefties don't do that sort of thing anymore....

It isn't only the Labour Party who are copying BNP policies. All three mainstream Parties are paying attention to our policies because they see this is what the British public want. The only thing keeping the UKIP together (for now) is the fact they have MEPs. Looking at some of the discussions on this forum that may not last too long either. There is also the pending Electoral Commission case where they want the UKIP to return over £300,000 and the investigation into NF paying his sons from EU funds. These could be enough to cripple the UKIP beyond redemption. Which would be a shame because they take votes away from the Tories.

Strange that you should mention the Holocaust and Palestine in the same paragraph as an Israeli Official has now threatned to wipe out the Palestinians in Gaza.

Robert Edwards

Hunter, it is not so much a case of other parties stealing the BNP's policies (what policies it has besides Muslim bashing) but a repeat of Thatcher's ploy in 1979 when she took a strong line on immigration and scuppered any chances the NF had of getting some of their candidates elected in a General Election. After the NF was thoroughly trashed she back-tracked on it all.
History repeats itself, it appears. They know the BNP could pose a small threat when it comes to the issue of illlegal immigration and asylum seekers and so they make noises that will surely take the wind out of the BNP's sails. You may choose to go into denial over this but that is what is about to happen.
Brown's Government is going to severely restrict non-European immigration into Britain with this points system and that is going to please a lot of people who may have been distracted by the BNP. They will now ignore the BNP because it has always been associated with a particularly nasty brand of racism ... not forgetting Islamophobia.
The mainstream press will collude with the Government over this and then it is "Good night, Vienna" for the BNP.
Too much emphasis is placed on this electioneering, building up people's hopes and then dashing them. Any political struggle worthy of the people is worth the long haul. A victory just over the horizon is but a mirage.

Hunter

I agree with you on most of this. I've already seen some of the methods the Government will use to hobble us. Has nobody wondered why they are so keen to push through the ratification of the EU 'Treaty'? Or why the other Parties are falling into line with them?

What seems to have put a spanner in their works is that some unforseen events are happening. For example the BBC are advertising a program about the feelings the indigenous white population have about being forced to accept multiculturalism. Add to this the coming local elections and the GLA elections it's possible they may have left it a little too late this time.

History only repeats itself to those who failed (or refused to) learn the lessons the previous time.

Robert Edwards

We have been in the European Union for quite some time now and a younger generation is growing up knowing little else but Britain in the EU. The British Empire is now in the misty past. They find your Euroscepticism reactionary.
Why are BNP people always looking for some kind of 'hidden hand' when it is all very clear what is going on? The Government is saying multi-culturalism has failed and now they demand assimilation which is something quite different. That is the reason for the new points system. I gather there is to be a TV programme on the white working class. Such things now constitute nostalgia.
They never leave it too late, Hunter. The state controls all of us to some frightening degree and its mouthpiece, the mainstream media, has the show completing in its grasp.
History repeats itself first in tragedy and then in farce, said Karl Marx. You can learn as many lessons as pleases you ... but when it comes to manipulation, they have the power.
If you want to play their party politics game then they invented the rules so that outsiders are kept well outside.

Hunter

This would have been true some years ago. The difference today is the amount of information available to the general public. The Poll Tax riots show that the British public will only take so much before they take action. The Government will do all it can to cripple us, even to the extent of using foreign laws. They will probably even break the rules to do so, but I think there is a limit to how far they are prepared to go. There are many MPs who do have a sense of ethics and the Government must be seen to be doing things right. It should be evident that the Government don't trust some of their own MPs else why would two posts be given to a single MP. Hain held the posts of Welsh Secretary as well as Work and Pensions, and Browne holds Scottish Secretary as well as Defense Secretary. Don't they have any more capable MPs? Or is it, as I believe, there aren't enough Marxist Labour MPs that Brown and Co trust?

steve fowler

Well this is the thing now isnt it Hunter with Brown now at the controls he and his party are now going compeletly control freak over us now and will do what ever they need to do to keep that control even if it means sacking a few rogue MPS, Plus he knows the that media communications like the internet are now becoming a threat to him and will also do what ever it takes to stop the people having a say on matters like playing with the public minds but as you stated its only becomes a matter of time before the public will keep taking this stuff with a beating before really do end up fighting back.

__________________
RULE BRITANNIA BRITANNIA RULES THE WAVES, BRITONS NEVER EVER SHALL BE SLAVE'S.

Never give in - never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.
Winston Churchill.

When Labour won the 1997 General Election, Enoch Powell told his wife that the electorate had voted to break up the United Kingdom.

Robert Edwards

Sorry to disappoint you all but all this talk about the great Joe public fighting back is pure fantasy. The masses have always been a great flock of sheep and will conform and do as the idiot box tells them.
The Poll Tax Riots, as mentioned before, were organised by anarchists and Trotskyists. The great Joe public just sat at home and watched it all on their idiot boxes. You would not get them out if you paid them.
The great means of mass communication, now in the hands of the money power and the state, will continue to rule.
Besides, who looks at Stormfront where BNP politics is played out among a small group of nasty semi-literates with absurd names? Joe public watches his idiot box and takes in all the documentaries on 'issues'. Perfect brain-washing. He will be fully groomed for the GLA elections, believe me.
Now you have to resort to posting on a UKIP forum because Stormfront has become the pits. Beats having to be bossed about by Lee Barnes, I suppose.

Vortex

Robert: The vast majority of BNP members have not heard of Stormfront and those that have take the views expressed on it with a large pinch of salt. SF is a classic example of a small group of people (anti-BNP) trying to exert influence through engaging in a game of multiple alaises posting multiple messages. Principle among these, as you know, are a group of embittered old Tyndallites sniping away at the edges, belittling the genuine achievements of nationalists and regurgitating smears and lies from far left sources such as Searchlight. Such is their hatred and indeed unhealthy (at least for their own mental health) obsession with the BNP that belittling it rather than advocating alternatives and trying to sell them appears to be their main political activity.

I don't include you in this category Robert, despite your anti-Griffin cartoons, as you genuinely appear to be motivated by your own political views and loyalty to Mosley. Political and indeed personal loyalty are rare commodities in modern British political life and I commend you for your frankness and openness.

Robert Edwards

Thank you for that, Vortex. It is politics that interest me and not this incessant sniping, the substitute presented by factionalism.
My anti-Griffin cartoons do not constitute the bulk of my political cartoons. I recall doing a series of about a dozen political cartoons for Dagenham and Barking BNP in a general and local elections a few years ago, resulting in the election of several councillors. They were used on election leaflets.
I am fortunate to be banned from Stormfront but UKIP have tolerated me for four years here, where I post from time to time. Good manners stand you in good stead in politics and teaches you restraint. I take a look at Stormfront about once a week and then recoil with a mixture of disgust and horror.
However, there are many people in what I call far-right reactionary nationalism who can not help themselves when ever they open their mouths or touch a keyboard. They have to be unpleasant.
Stormfront is populated by both Griffin loyalists and rebel faction. Don Black is a friend of Griffin and Don Black runs Stormfront. 'Purging the Droid' on Stormfront is Griffin. Lee Barnes, another foul-mouthed maniac, also posts there.
I have always used my real name on forums and see no reason to adopt absurd nicknames or whatever they call them.