What will we call the UK when Scotland leaves ?

Edward Longshanks · 10-10-2006, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by This-England

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edward Longshanks

Quote:

Originally Posted by This-England

Because until now the EDP didnt go as far as the public wanted on issues like immigration.
The fact that English Nationalists in Blackburn have beaten the BNP 3 times on the trot shows the potential.

Actually that's very much a local phenomenon and they are a tiny party (less than 50 members). However, they have performed well, won 2 seats on Blackburn Council and polled 13.4% to the BNP's 9.7% recently.

The irony is that they are ex-BNP hardliners who think Griffin has watered down the BNP's policies while they remain loyal to Tyndall's interpretation of Nationalism. However I believe that rather important point isn't actually imparted to the Blackburn electorate when they stand. :roll:

But they have all so watered down their policys recently too and set up a branch in Burnley with others on the way.
The EDP has toughened its policys so i can see a big rise in support for English Nationalism at local level coming soon.

Hmm maybe you'll get more votes than the "British" National Front at the next by election you both fight? 8)

Actually time is running out we are basically all on the same side, don't let our enemies divide us :cry:

Edward Longshanks · 10-10-2006, 04:11 PM

Or in other words let's unite against the pro-EU old gang parties and then sort out the other differences ourselves.

Independence Now! · 10-10-2006, 09:48 PM

Precisely.

andypandy · 10-10-2006, 10:45 PM

UKIP does not do deals with "nazi" parties though, does it? It is all very well talking about uniting, but if people, particularly some on this forum, keep using the language and terminology of the far left and pro-EU-ites, then failure is an absolute certainty, as votes will continue to be split between the "nice" patriots and the "nasty" patriots.

Where does it end? The political system in this country is too antiquated and undemocractic to allow real change to take place, and certainly not within a rapid timespan. No electoral system can really be called democratic if in addition to allowing people to choose their representatives, it denies them the right to SACK those elected officials if they do not perform adequately, irrespective of the time in office. We have NO safeguards in place to get them out, only to put them in.

The dependence on privately owned media groups to spread each political party's message is also ridden with the personalised opinions of those in charge who will destroy the character and attitudes of any individuals they wish, as long as the general political/economic structure remains intact.

Populist Lee · 10-10-2006, 10:56 PM

You claim to be a supporter of the English Democrats, andypandy; and you must be aware that they will not do a deal with "nazi" parties, either.

Perhaps you should aim more of your criticism at your favoured party.

The Chairman of the BNP isn't renowned for wanting to do deals, also.

Perhaps one of the first moves in this arena should be a purge of the leadership of these parties.
Place the process into the hands of the rank and file members of each party.

This-England · 10-10-2006, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andypandy

UKIP does not do deals with "nazi" parties though, does it? It is all very well talking about uniting, but if people, particularly some on this forum, keep using the language and terminology of the far left and pro-EU-ites, then failure is an absolute certainty, as votes will continue to be split between the "nice" patriots and the "nasty" patriots.

Where does it end? The political system in this country is too antiquated and undemocractic to allow real change to take place, and certainly not within a rapid timespan. No electoral system can really be called democratic if in addition to allowing people to choose their representatives, it denies them the right to SACK those elected officials if they do not perform adequately, irrespective of the time in office. We have NO safeguards in place to get them out, only to put them in.

The dependence on privately owned media groups to spread each political party's message is also ridden with the personalised opinions of those in charge who will destroy the character and attitudes of any individuals they wish, as long as the general political/economic structure remains intact.

This is 100% right.

This-England · 10-10-2006, 10:59 PM

The Labour party of course has no worries about allowing ex-members of the Communist party to join its ranks and even sit in government.

Yet UKIP and the Conservatives are terrified if the Left even mention one of its members once attended a BNP meeting.

andypandy · 10-10-2006, 11:24 PM

Populist Lee, I don't claim to be a supporter of the English Democrats, I am one; at the same time, the constant sniping at the success of the BNP does nothing for those that relish such spiteful criticisms. The real losers are those that are generally opposed to the likes of the BNP on 'moral' grounds, but are hindered electorally by their own comparative failures.

They will use these moral grounds to justify their stance, and to denounce the opinions of parties such as the BNP.

Perhaps if others, and that includes the EDP, were half as successful in first past the post elections as the BNP, then they would have reasonable grounds to be critical. But they are not, and in recent times, it is the BNP that have saved more deposits, had more people elected, achieved the best parliamentary results and largely have had their primary stance at the top of the political agenda now for the last 7 years or so. This is not my say so, but the apparent will of tens of thousands of voters, and countless front page headlines.

How anyone can call them nazis, then attempt to 'recruit' the very same voters over to the fold of their party with similar but watered down policies, is really stupid, ignorant and hypocritical. If they were essentially evil, you would not touch those that vote for them with a barge pole, after all, of all parties, it is the BNP that have had their insides ripped out for the benefit of the general media. If, after years of trying, all they can produce is heresay evidence and the (very) odd secret filming of people using 'offensive' language, then god help our future justice system. On that basis, probably half the population would be on a BBC tv programme for having views contrary to the national good.

If you can't discuss the activities of other parties without someone suggesting secret sympathies, then what the feck are we all bothering for in the first place? I don't want to see an end to one tyranny just so it can be replaced by another one of the political correct inept.

The bottom line is, it is the voters themselves who will and should remain the final say on these matters.

John Carter · 11-10-2006, 11:59 AM

I kind of like the current Apple naming scheme, so I'm gonna go with:

"England Extreme"

Edward Longshanks · 11-10-2006, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andypandy

Populist Lee, I don't claim to be a supporter of the English Democrats, I am one; at the same time, the constant sniping at the success of the BNP does nothing for those that relish such spiteful criticisms. The real losers are those that are generally opposed to the likes of the BNP on 'moral' grounds, but are hindered electorally by their own comparative failures.

They will use these moral grounds to justify their stance, and to denounce the opinions of parties such as the BNP.

Perhaps if others, and that includes the EDP, were half as successful in first past the post elections as the BNP, then they would have reasonable grounds to be critical. But they are not, and in recent times, it is the BNP that have saved more deposits, had more people elected, achieved the best parliamentary results and largely have had their primary stance at the top of the political agenda now for the last 7 years or so. This is not my say so, but the apparent will of tens of thousands of voters, and countless front page headlines.

How anyone can call them nazis, then attempt to 'recruit' the very same voters over to the fold of their party with similar but watered down policies, is really stupid, ignorant and hypocritical. If they were essentially evil, you would not touch those that vote for them with a barge pole, after all, of all parties, it is the BNP that have had their insides ripped out for the benefit of the general media. If, after years of trying, all they can produce is heresay evidence and the (very) odd secret filming of people using 'offensive' language, then god help our future justice system. On that basis, probably half the population would be on a BBC tv programme for having views contrary to the national good.

If you can't discuss the activities of other parties without someone suggesting secret sympathies, then what the feck are we all bothering for in the first place? I don't want to see an end to one tyranny just so it can be replaced by another one of the political correct inept.

The bottom line is, it is the voters themselves who will and should remain the final say on these matters.

Good post AP.

View Poll Results: What should the UK be called without Scotland
Britain	4	22.22%
Greater England	2	11.11%
England	1	5.56%
England, Wales & Northern Ireland	3	16.67%
None of the above	8	44.44%
Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

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10-10-2006, 04:11 PM	#22 (permalink)
Edward Longshanks Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bucks Posts: 625	Or in other words let's unite against the pro-EU old gang parties and then sort out the other differences ourselves.

10-10-2006, 09:48 PM	#23 (permalink)
Independence Now! Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,096	Precisely.

10-10-2006, 10:45 PM	#24 (permalink)
andypandy Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 880	UKIP does not do deals with "nazi" parties though, does it? It is all very well talking about uniting, but if people, particularly some on this forum, keep using the language and terminology of the far left and pro-EU-ites, then failure is an absolute certainty, as votes will continue to be split between the "nice" patriots and the "nasty" patriots. Where does it end? The political system in this country is too antiquated and undemocractic to allow real change to take place, and certainly not within a rapid timespan. No electoral system can really be called democratic if in addition to allowing people to choose their representatives, it denies them the right to SACK those elected officials if they do not perform adequately, irrespective of the time in office. We have NO safeguards in place to get them out, only to put them in. The dependence on privately owned media groups to spread each political party's message is also ridden with the personalised opinions of those in charge who will destroy the character and attitudes of any individuals they wish, as long as the general political/economic structure remains intact.

10-10-2006, 10:56 PM	#25 (permalink)
Populist Lee Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Dorset Posts: 1,903 Party: Other	You claim to be a supporter of the English Democrats, andypandy; and you must be aware that they will not do a deal with "nazi" parties, either. Perhaps you should aim more of your criticism at your favoured party. The Chairman of the BNP isn't renowned for wanting to do deals, also. Perhaps one of the first moves in this arena should be a purge of the leadership of these parties. Place the process into the hands of the rank and file members of each party.

10-10-2006, 10:59 PM	#27 (permalink)
This-England Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,682	The Labour party of course has no worries about allowing ex-members of the Communist party to join its ranks and even sit in government. Yet UKIP and the Conservatives are terrified if the Left even mention one of its members once attended a BNP meeting.

10-10-2006, 11:24 PM	#28 (permalink)
andypandy Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 880	Populist Lee, I don't claim to be a supporter of the English Democrats, I am one; at the same time, the constant sniping at the success of the BNP does nothing for those that relish such spiteful criticisms. The real losers are those that are generally opposed to the likes of the BNP on 'moral' grounds, but are hindered electorally by their own comparative failures. They will use these moral grounds to justify their stance, and to denounce the opinions of parties such as the BNP. Perhaps if others, and that includes the EDP, were half as successful in first past the post elections as the BNP, then they would have reasonable grounds to be critical. But they are not, and in recent times, it is the BNP that have saved more deposits, had more people elected, achieved the best parliamentary results and largely have had their primary stance at the top of the political agenda now for the last 7 years or so. This is not my say so, but the apparent will of tens of thousands of voters, and countless front page headlines. How anyone can call them nazis, then attempt to 'recruit' the very same voters over to the fold of their party with similar but watered down policies, is really stupid, ignorant and hypocritical. If they were essentially evil, you would not touch those that vote for them with a barge pole, after all, of all parties, it is the BNP that have had their insides ripped out for the benefit of the general media. If, after years of trying, all they can produce is heresay evidence and the (very) odd secret filming of people using 'offensive' language, then god help our future justice system. On that basis, probably half the population would be on a BBC tv programme for having views contrary to the national good. If you can't discuss the activities of other parties without someone suggesting secret sympathies, then what the feck are we all bothering for in the first place? I don't want to see an end to one tyranny just so it can be replaced by another one of the political correct inept. The bottom line is, it is the voters themselves who will and should remain the final say on these matters.

11-10-2006, 11:59 AM	#29 (permalink)
John Carter Uber Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: On Sabbatical Posts: 5,110	I kind of like the current Apple naming scheme, so I'm gonna go with: "England Extreme"