British Democracy Forum - View Single Post - The Recession will complete sterling's sabotage

Aardvark · 08-05-2008, 09:51 AM

YCHTT,

Noakes has made an unsupported sweeping generalisation about the membership of quangoes and has provided no evidence to support it. He hasn't even got the exact figure for the number of quangoes, let alone the exact figure for their costs. He also treats the costs as a loss to society, but people who work should be paid.

That was the point I was making. I know, as there are 330,000 (apparently) UK Freemasons, that it is logical that some of them will be in positions of influence within society. Most Freemasons I know, and as a mason I know a few, are either retired or at the tail end of their careers and many have achieved a lot on life, many have been less successful. A lot of Freemasons are humble people from ordinary jobs who actually attend lodges as an excuse to get out of their scruffy clothes and into a suit or DJ for the night or to get away from the stresses of work. I have met a few policemen who are masons - they do it to get away from the police for the evening and to forget work, not to plan the control of society. Most older travelling showmen are masons - fairground and circus workers etc - and they have their own peripatetic lodge. If you'd spent your day covered in dust and diesel fumes it would be a nice change to dress up and get away from the constant background noise of Chirpy, Chirpy, Cheap, Cheap played at full volume, but I digress.

I was a non-executive director of a quango, a NHS trust, and the amount I received (as a band of pay) was published in the accounts which were presented at a public meeting. I was appointed on the basis of a strong CV, my membership of freemasonry was not an issue as I didn't mention it and the interviewers didn't ask. We oversaw the running of 22 surgeries and 4 community hospitals, all of the community nurses and a mass of other responsibilities. We were paid for the substantial amount of time we gave and I was allowed on one conference, in 4 years, run by one of CP's rivals. The PCT system has been restructured, but the management of the health service will not cease if UKIP get into power or we leave the EU, nor will lower paid people with no qualifications or experience be allowed to run the system. It is politically illiterate to talk as if all quangoes do nothing and will cease once UKIP come to power. We will need to have a review of the roles of the various quangoes and we could certainly, IMHO, reduce the number and cost, but they will not all go away and those that remain will still cost something. It will not be an overnight process in the same way as withdrawing from the EU in good order and with a stable economy will not happen overnight. I'm not pro-EU for recognising the reality of the situation and I am not a disinformation specialist in the way those who live on fantasy island seem to be.

YCHTT, Noakes has provided no evidence to support his general assertions. Where is his evidence that Bilderbergers, CP or Masons control all quangoes? None is provided. That's not dealing in facts, that is, as with so many of the 'conspiracy theorists' dealing in supposition and rumour.

What is the source of Noakes' figures? Where is the list of quangoes to be found? As they are public bodies their membership will be declared and Noakes can, with proof, highlight those members he knows to be masons, those he knows to be Bilderbergers and those he knows to have attended CP training.

08-05-2008, 09:51 AM	#44 (permalink)
Aardvark Moderator Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Oxonia Posts: 3,693	YCHTT, Noakes has made an unsupported sweeping generalisation about the membership of quangoes and has provided no evidence to support it. He hasn't even got the exact figure for the number of quangoes, let alone the exact figure for their costs. He also treats the costs as a loss to society, but people who work should be paid. That was the point I was making. I know, as there are 330,000 (apparently) UK Freemasons, that it is logical that some of them will be in positions of influence within society. Most Freemasons I know, and as a mason I know a few, are either retired or at the tail end of their careers and many have achieved a lot on life, many have been less successful. A lot of Freemasons are humble people from ordinary jobs who actually attend lodges as an excuse to get out of their scruffy clothes and into a suit or DJ for the night or to get away from the stresses of work. I have met a few policemen who are masons - they do it to get away from the police for the evening and to forget work, not to plan the control of society. Most older travelling showmen are masons - fairground and circus workers etc - and they have their own peripatetic lodge. If you'd spent your day covered in dust and diesel fumes it would be a nice change to dress up and get away from the constant background noise of Chirpy, Chirpy, Cheap, Cheap played at full volume, but I digress. I was a non-executive director of a quango, a NHS trust, and the amount I received (as a band of pay) was published in the accounts which were presented at a public meeting. I was appointed on the basis of a strong CV, my membership of freemasonry was not an issue as I didn't mention it and the interviewers didn't ask. We oversaw the running of 22 surgeries and 4 community hospitals, all of the community nurses and a mass of other responsibilities. We were paid for the substantial amount of time we gave and I was allowed on one conference, in 4 years, run by one of CP's rivals. The PCT system has been restructured, but the management of the health service will not cease if UKIP get into power or we leave the EU, nor will lower paid people with no qualifications or experience be allowed to run the system. It is politically illiterate to talk as if all quangoes do nothing and will cease once UKIP come to power. We will need to have a review of the roles of the various quangoes and we could certainly, IMHO, reduce the number and cost, but they will not all go away and those that remain will still cost something. It will not be an overnight process in the same way as withdrawing from the EU in good order and with a stable economy will not happen overnight. I'm not pro-EU for recognising the reality of the situation and I am not a disinformation specialist in the way those who live on fantasy island seem to be. YCHTT, Noakes has provided no evidence to support his general assertions. Where is his evidence that Bilderbergers, CP or Masons control all quangoes? None is provided. That's not dealing in facts, that is, as with so many of the 'conspiracy theorists' dealing in supposition and rumour. What is the source of Noakes' figures? Where is the list of quangoes to be found? As they are public bodies their membership will be declared and Noakes can, with proof, highlight those members he knows to be masons, those he knows to be Bilderbergers and those he knows to have attended CP training. __________________ When in Woking do as the Wokes do. "I do not wish to form my opinions by thoughtlessly quoting others; I wish others to support their opinions by sensibly quoting me." Paul Wesson (Aardvark) 13th April 2008 Last edited by Aardvark; 09-05-2008 at 08:56 PM.