Quote:
|
Originally Posted by The Trooper
What is the point in a so called English parliament? Was it not the English who conquered the Welsh and the Scotts? Basically what the English democrats are suggesting is that we give up these conquests, for some fanciful dream of England will be better on its own. If that was true we would not have conquered them in the first place. .
|
Actually, I don't want to be pedantic, but your history is a bit flawed. England did conquer Wales, but it failed to conquer Scotland (not for lack of trying, either!)
England finally conquered Wales in 1282, when the last native Prince of Wales was killed by an English trooper and resistance collapsed for a while. There was an uprising led by Owain Glyndwr in around 1399 which was successful for a few years, but the English had crushed the rising by about 1406. However, in 1485 an Anglo-Welsh nobleman called Henry Tudor (descendent of a native Welsh ruler, Rhys ap Gruffydd of Deheubarth), backed by Welsh troops, defeated Richard III at Bosworth Field to become King of England. The French ambassador commented that Wales had regained its independence. Henry Tudor of course became Henry VII of England, and his son Henry VIII passed the first Act of Union, uniting Wales and England. Therefore it
could be argued that the English conquest of Wales was just a temporary phenomenon, and that the modern British state was founded by a Welshman. A rather dodgy argument, IMHO, though it is surely true that the idea of a united, independent British state was a Tudor invention.
The story with Scotland is much clearer. Various brief periods of English rule were thrown off by successful Scottish resistance, and the country maintained its independence until modern times. However, in 1603 the king of Scotland was offered the throne of England too, which permanently united the two monarchies. Thereofre it
could be argued that Scotland took over England rather than 'tother way around.
Anyway, this history is all very interesting, but what matters is where we are now, and where we all go from here.